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Old 06-17-2013, 12:31 AM   #21
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Re: 4" or 6" Ujoint lift

Quote:
Originally Posted by UJOINT
I wouldn't recommend 3.55's for any conversion unless the stock tire size is used (this NEVER happens!)
Here's the deal. Either don't ever listen to me or, at the very least, please take anything I say with a big grain of salt. Because, seriously, your results may vary due to the fact that I obviously have a different take on things.

When you go (at least 2002) E350 stock van to (at least 2007 F250/F350) 4x4 solid front axle you need to increase the size of your wheel rims to (at least) 17" to clear the bigger brake rotors on the 4x4 front axle.*

I had been used to relatively good fuel mileage, so I wanted to stay as close to stock tire size as possible.

So at my request the 4x4 converter put on the closest diameter tire he could find in the Toyo Open Country AT's which he preferred. I have since changed to Michelin LTX MS2's.** Here are the dimensions:

Ford OEM Tire (2002): LT245/75R 16E Diameter: 30.5"
Toyo Open Country AT: LT265/70R17 Diameter: 31.6"
Michelin LTX MS2: LT265/70R17/E Diameter: 31.7"

So, since I did go an inch up in diameter, I guess Chris Steuber is right. But my intent was to stay as close to stock as possible.**

In fact, I don't see anything sexy about big tires, just like I don't care about big lifts.*** I care about function. If big tires function better, tell me why because I don't know it, at least for my application which is traveling on pavement on snow and ice in 4x4.

So, do I want to have my differentials changed from 3.73 back to 3.55? Uhh, like I said before, yes.****

* I had 8 tires (studded and non-studded) and 8 rims which I had to sell on craigslist!
** I now see that there is actually a 17" tire which is even closer to my stock tire LT245/70R17/E 119 R Diameter 30.6.
*** I guess I am a hypocrite because I am considering a 2" body lift so I can have more room under the hood to access the valve covers and so I can place the under the hood starting battery on the frame rail in my homemade house and starting battery frame rail tray. calebmogul: UJoint's 4" lift seems to have more suspension travel than my 4x4 lift, so I agree with your decision to go with a 4" lift.
**** I want my overdrive back!
***** This may help you in your analysis:

Maybe someone with more knowledge than me can add the effect of the various standard tire sizes to this chart.
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4R100 Gearing Ratios 1.jpg  

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Old 07-01-2013, 08:07 AM   #22
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Re: 4" or 6" Ujoint lift

I DON'T HAVE A UJOINT CONVERSION

My conversion was done by Salem-Kroger.

However, in considering whether to go with a 4" or 6" lift you may want to specifically ask whether or not the lifted height is more, less or the same as the bump stop gap measurement.

(When I ordered my 4x4 conversion with 4" lift, I naively assumed that I would have 4" of travel before the suspension bottomed out on the frame. Not so.)

The gap between the bump stops determines when you bottom out. (Not the lifted height.)

With a 4" lift, my van has 2" before the cross-member supporting the motor mounts bottoms out on the front axle. Looking at these pictures, I see that the cross-member is slightly bent which no doubt means that the bump stops actually have too large a gap for my suspension (maybe the stops have compressed since it was converted in 2007?):



I edited my post at the suggestion of BroncoHauler to make it clear that I DON'T have a UJOINT conversion. However, after owning and driving two 4x4 converted vans (first a leaf spring, second a coil), it is my personal opinion that the bump stop gap measurement is something you should consider when choosing whether or not to go with a 4" or 6" lift -- which is the actual question posed by the OP. And remember, I have a different take on things (which often causes me to go off topic especially when, based on my experience, the question itself may not be formulated broadly enough to encompass the OP's actual concerns). A lot of times you don't know something until you do it, and after which you would have done it a different way. I don't know everything, but I have learned some things from my mistakes along the way... So, as always, YRMV. Hopefully this helps the OP and also adds to the general information pool.

Additional Edit: I see that the bend in the cross-member is located above the bracket for the dual opposing pressurized gas shocks which I installed (after Salem-Kroger was unable to permanently cure my Death Wobble). That bracket undoubtedly reduced the gap slightly, but as you can see it was never more than about 2.5"
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Front axle travel - lq.jpg   Front Axle clearance.jpg   Front Axle clearance bump stop.jpg  
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Old 07-01-2013, 08:15 AM   #23
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Re: 4" or 6" Ujoint lift

[quote="E350"]With a 4" lift, my van has 2" before the cross-member supporting the motor mount bottoms out on the front axle. Looking at these pictures, I see that the cross-member is slightly bend which no doubt means that the bump stops have too large a space:

[quote]

Maybe I'm wrong, but you don't have a U Joint 4x4 conversion, do you? Not sure how these pics relate to a thread specifically about a U Joint conversion.

I wouldn't want people to get the wrong impression with U Joint conversions ending up with bent cross members. If you do have a U Joint conversion, by all means address the questions here.


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Old 11-06-2013, 03:34 PM   #24
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Re: 4" or 6" Ujoint lift





I wanted to thank everyone who contributed to this thread. The amount of information and help offered on this forum is awesome.

Just got home from UJOINT a couple days ago. I went ahead with a Ujoint Stage II front axle,4.10 gear change, and 4" lift. Put some 33" BFG's on. Driving west bound out of Asheville on I40 I was laughing out loud and absolutely thrilled with the ride quality of Chris's conversion. The 45-65 mph curves on the route were a blast. I was really worried about losing highway performance with the lifted 4x4 conversion, but the ride quality was far and away improved from stock. Having driven several different Quigley and Advanced 4x4 conversions, I have to say that the Ujoint ride is a far superior experience. I even got to test it on some snowy/icy roads yesterday as we had another early snowstorm here in Telluride, CO. Traction and handling were awesome. Only time will tell exactly how impressed I am with the conversion as the off road ability and longevity is tested, but initially I'm extremely pleased with the UJOINT experience.
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Old 11-06-2013, 07:50 PM   #25
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Re: 4" or 6" Ujoint lift

What a difference BTW, really like the color as well.


I got to get out your way one of these days to do some off roading. It's on the bucket list.
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Old 11-07-2013, 08:36 AM   #26
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Re: 4" or 6" Ujoint lift

Glad that you enjoy it ! It was nice to meet you there.:-)
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Old 11-07-2013, 09:48 AM   #27
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Re: 4" or 6" Ujoint lift

Good news!

Thanks again for letting us convert the van. Look forward to seeing it tearing up the snow!
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Old 11-07-2013, 12:12 PM   #28
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Re: 4" or 6" Ujoint lift

Nothing for me to add to this thread except good looking van for snow country! (And that my wife and I love chasing one of the local residents through Jack's Trees and Log Pile and Andy's on a powder day and having a beer and pulled pork sandwich at Giuseppe's at 11,890 feet.)
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Old 11-07-2013, 08:35 PM   #29
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Re: 4" or 6" Ujoint lift

Yep, looking forward to exploring my own backyard with the higher aspect! I'm sure you'd enjoy the trip daveb, the San Juan skyway has a ton of variety and you're bound to find some great campsites with amazing views in your rig. It blows me away how tough those miners were making roads! E350 has it right when he speaks of some of the quality skiing around here too. I'm gonna have to work on some "powder shots" of the van for Chris! He seems pretty busy building vans so I'm not sure he'll be able to make it out this winter.

The color is growing on me. By the time I get around to having the money to fix some of the dents and paint it I may just keep it. There's definitely still a lot I'd like to get done on 'er first though. (spare tire might be a start) Before I get to a lot more interior mods I think I'll be looking for a tuner next, and looking at ways to try to pick back up a mpg or two. Driving around here on the highway is mostly 65 or less with a lot of hills. The 4.1 gearing seems great so far around here as I got 15ish mpg on my first couple tanks. (small sample ) The trade-off is going 70-80 out on the freeway is a different story. I averaged 12.5 from Asheville home. Big difference between 70mph speed limits and lots of cops back east, vs B-lining across Kansas at 80. I think E350 is on to it with his assessment of gas mileage as affected by gearing and tire size. It definitely feels like I "lost my overdrive." It seems to be running higher rpms at 70+ but at the same time the engine seems to be working less up the hills and starting out from 0-5. I'd like to think I lost 2mpg but probably closer to 3.

Sounds like Chris has some tuner options, so i'm gonna talk to him after I make some more dough. Any suggestions? I'm sure there is lot's of info on this site, so I better go look before I diverge on this thread...



p.s. crazy trip home from ujoint with my freind bob. picked him up in Kentucky Saturday morning and we drove straight thru to Morgan Lake near shiprock, NM and caught a sweet windsurf sesh on Sunday! Boy that Elmer Kentucky Whiskey hit the spot at the end of the road....
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Old 12-22-2015, 06:41 PM   #30
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Hey Caleb,

So after having the 4" for a couple years now (I am assuming you still have it), do you wish you would have gone with a 6" or are you happy with the 4"? I am currently in the same decision making process and am looking for a little insight.

Thanks!
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