Quigley and QuadVan - FOX Shox Ride Improvement Package

[BajaSportsmobile]

Originally Posted by Tapatio

Thoughts on doing the same for SMB suspensions? Not sure how much longer my Old Man Emu's are going to hold up.

Funny you should ask. Last Friday I was driving north through Camp Pendleton on I5 and there was a beautiful SMB ahead of us on the road. It was a Green SMB RB Penthouse with fluorescent orange ladder and steps. I figured it was a Quigley and followed it to watch the suspension. The rear end was loose as could be, bouncing along and looking unsettled, and the front suspension was stiff as a Buckboard and I thought that odd. I followed it for several miles and videoed it with my phone. When I pulled up beside it, I realized it was an SMB with leaf springs up front and not a coil sprung Quigley.

The SMB's have a pretty short front leaf spring, and I wasn't surprised by the ride when I saw what it was. Just the rear FOX Shox would greatly help that rig - not sure what to do about the front without spending some time with one.

[E350]

Quick question: I am attracted to the Bilstein gas pressurized shocks because they may raise the ride height 1" to 2" inches? Since the Fox Shox are custom valved and rebuildable, my guess is that they are not pressurized. Am I asking for the shock to do what the spring should do? So, is it better to re-spring or do something else to get more bump travel out of the suspension foregoing the gas pressurized Bilsteins, and then just add the Fox Shox for what a shock is supposed to do -- dampen the momentum of mass?

Thanks for the information.

[BTW, on ford-trucks.com we can give green chiclets to add to the reputation of other members for extra helpful posts/threads. Maybe the Admins can consider adding that option on this forum? There are some members here who are exceedingly helpful (my posts excluded) and you sir are one of those members whose contributions should be acknowledged.]

[BajaSportsmobile]

All of these Mono Tube type shocks are "gas pressurized" generally to 200 psi to reduce cavitation of the oil. When I rebuild them, Bilstein or FOX, I recharge them with Nitrogen to their original spec - 200 psi.

Neither of these shocks will provide enough "Air Shock" affect to lift your van more than a fraction of an inch - calculated shaft force is only ~125 lbs at mid travel. You can prove this to yourself by collapsing the shock by hand, applying 125 lbs of force. Get under the van and "bench press" it the same 125 lbs and you won't lift it much.

You are right, springs hold up the vehicle, shocks damp.

Originally Posted by E350

Quick question: I am attracted to the Bilstein gas pressurized shocks because they may raise the ride height 1" to 2" inches? Since the Fox Shox are custom valved and rebuildable, my guess is that they are not pressurized. Am I asking for the shock to do what the spring should do? So, is it better to re-spring or do something else to get more bump travel out of the suspension foregoing the gas pressurized Bilsteins, and then just add the Fox Shox for what a shock is supposed to do -- dampen the momentum of mass?

[BTW, on ford-trucks.com we can give green chiclets to add to the reputation of other members for extra helpful posts/threads. Maybe the Admins can consider adding that option on this forum? There are some members here who are exceedingly helpful (mine excluded) and you sir are one of those members whose contributions should be acknowledged.]

[SwellGuy]

I am very interested in this. I have a 2001 extended-body E-350 Quigley and have never liked the way it has handled from day one. My most recent effort to correct this issue was a replacement of the rear spring pack from Deaver to get full rear travel (remove the blocks), add a leaf or two, and lift it another 1.5." I also replaced all the shocks with Bilsteins. I still have the Quigley coils on the front. The Deaver springs on another fourm member's van were way too stiff and we made a huge improvement in his ride by removing select leafs from the packs. Do you like the way the Deavers work? Another thing to consider when removing the Quigley lift blocks and going with the Deavers is that the bump travel is increased because it now bottoms out on the axle and not on the lift block extensions. This could result in bottoming out the shocks well before the axle bottoms out on the frame bumps, if this wasn't accounted for. Were the shocks added after the Deavers and correct lengths selected? The welded on extensions the Quigley puts on the rear lower shock mounts will effect this problem.

AFAIK, the correct leafs were selected by Deaver. I let them design it. It added 1.5" to the rear lift and now has full travel. They also spec'd out the shocks after we installed the springs, so I'm confident that it was done well.

I'm a little leery of replacing all the shocks so soon after upgrading to the Bilsteins, but wondering if I could get away with just the front spring upgrade since that's the only thing undone on my rig to date? Sounds like the front shock might have to be replaced anyway if travel increases? Is the rear shock upgrade really necessary given that Bilsteins are pretty good shocks?
If I were you, I would start by replacing the coil springs only, they will make a big difference. The ~1" increase in bump travel and the higher spring rate should complement the Deaver rear springs. Bilstein are great shocks and should work for you. The difference is that the FOX Shox have been valved for these Quigleys and probably have considerably more valving in them. We removed perfectly good Bilsteins from Ocsmb's van and the improvement is very noticable. Start with the springs and see where that gets you.

Yes, would like to swap out front springs - it's the only thing I haven't changed yet. I think I would need to do shocks too if you increase ride height, right? Btw, how much additional lift do these springs add over stock Quigley height? Can you spec out springs AT stock Quigley height? I kinda like where I'm at now.

Sounds like you're in Carlsbad, I'm in Nor Cal, would you need to see the rig before you could provide parts? I can help you find the springs in your area. If you want shocks, I would need pictures of your front axle's lower shock mounts. On the rear, because of the Deavers, we would need some pictures and measurements.

OK, send me your e-mail, and I'd be happy to send you pics.

[vandiesel]

I have a Quadvan that I run as a transformer. Most of the time I'm towing stuff and hauling the family around Oregon. My 4x4 activities are mostly in the snow. So my question is will this baja setup address the stiffness and hard ride? I moved from a plush suburban and tried to convince my wife that the ride won't be bad. It wanders a fair amount and bounces over bumps. Quadvan is throwing a winch in it next week and cutting my fender wells to clear the tires. I was thinking of having him add the steering stabilizer to it that he designed. With this correct the wander or is that tied in with my now identified ride problems? I'm trying to visualize the ride but really have no comparisons. Any input will help me not spend money twice here. I have bilsteins all the way around from the conversion.

[PatO]

Originally Posted by BajaSportsmobile

The SMB's have a pretty short front leaf spring, and I wasn't surprised by the ride when I saw what it was. Just the rear FOX Shox would greatly help that rig - not sure what to do about the front without spending some time with one.

I'd be happy to "Spring" for some FOX Shox for the rear of my SMB 4x4. I have an SMB Lite though; just seats and storage, no big battery or other weighty options. The original Rancho 9000 are still on it all the way around with 66K miles. I just keep the adjustment in the middle but it's possible they are shot the way I bounce around. There are new ball joints and tie rod ends but I still need to replace the front spring bushings which are very sloppy. Starting to sound like a project but something needs to be done! Maybe we should chat about it.

Pat down in San Diego

[BajaSportsmobile]

Originally Posted by SwellGuy

AFAIK, the correct leafs were selected by Deaver. I let them design it. It added 1.5" to the rear lift and now has full travel. They also spec'd out the shocks after we installed the springs, so I'm confident that it was done well.
Does the rear axle's lower shock mounts still have the silly 2.5 inch extensions that Quigley welds on them?

Measure the distance between the rubber bump stop and where it contacts the rear axle, and then measure the length of the exposed shock shaft. If there is 6 inches of travel before the axle bottoms out on the bump stop and there is only 4 inches of exposed shock shaft - you may have a problem.

Yes, would like to swap out front springs - it's the only thing I haven't changed yet. I think I would need to do shocks too if you increase ride height, right? Btw, how much additional lift do these springs add over stock Quigley height? Can you spec out springs AT stock Quigley height? I kinda like where I'm at now.
Well, if you are like every other Quigley out there, "where you are now" is just about riding on the rubber bump stops up front, and that is the problem. Take a look under the front of your van and measure the distance between the front axle landing pad and the rubber bump stop and let us know. Your Quigley only has ~5.5 inches of front travel, we just want to get it in the middle of that range at ride height. If your Deavers lifted the rear 1.5 inches then the Van must sit raked with the rear high, not what most are looking for. Your front shocks should be fine as far as dimensions are concerned.

Send me your e-mail, and I'd be happy to send you pics.
ramseyelwardani@gmail.com

[BajaSportsmobile]

I looked through your Gallery photos but there were no pictures of your van as a 4X4 that showed its stance and lift.

The first thing that you and everyone concerned with these ride issues should do is look under their van at the front axle and identify the rubber bump stop on the frame just above the axle and then measure the distance between that bump stop and the axle. Then ask yourself, is the "stiffness and hard ride" due to the fact that the axle can only move a short distance before it bottoms out and then transfers all the force to the van and the occupants. In a van as opposed to a truck, you are sitting just about right over the axle - you're going to feel it. Do the same for the rear axle...

Once you get the travel issues sorted out, you are going to want to control it with the right shocks.

Originally Posted by vandiesel

I have a Quadvan that I run as a transformer. Most of the time I'm towing stuff and hauling the family around Oregon. My 4x4 activities are mostly in the snow. So my question is will this baja setup address the stiffness and hard ride? I moved from a plush suburban and tried to convince my wife that the ride won't be bad. It wanders a fair amount and bounces over bumps. Quadvan is throwing a winch in it next week and cutting my fender wells to clear the tires. I was thinking of having him add the steering stabilizer to it that he designed. With this correct the wander or is that tied in with my now identified ride problems? I'm trying to visualize the ride but really have no comparisons. Any input will help me not spend money twice here. I have bilsteins all the way around from the conversion.

Adding the weight of a winch and bumper to the front suspension is just going to add to the problem.

Steering stabilizer is not going to solve any problems typically.

[BajaSportsmobile]

Come by the shop sometime - I should be there on Friday doing an install. It is in El Cajon, so not too far.

Originally Posted by PatO

I'd be happy to "Spring" for some FOX Shox for the rear of my SMB 4x4. I have an SMB Lite though; just seats and storage, no big battery or other weighty options. The original Rancho 9000 are still on it all the way around with 66K miles. I just keep the adjustment in the middle but it's possible they are shot the way I bounce around. There are new ball joints and tie rod ends but I still need to replace the front spring bushings which are very sloppy. Starting to sound like a project but something needs to be done! Maybe we should chat about it.

Pat down in San Diego

[BajaSportsmobile]

I received a phone call an hour or so ago from the owner of the first Quigley that I did the install on just two weeks ago. It is 7.3L RB with Penthouse and full interior - heavy.

He and his wife just returned from the Sierras, up around Mammoth Lakes, and did a fair amount of off-road - which he normally does.

His wife drove the van for the first time, and he saw her tense up as she was about to hit a bump, she knew what was coming next after so many miles in the van over the years - but nothing happened! He said she was "stoked" and they both feel like they have a whole new van - "we love it".

I've got to say it makes me feel great to know this is really working and worth the effort.

I wish he was a poster here. He was referred to me by FOX several weeks ago.