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Old 02-18-2010, 02:01 PM   #11
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Re: Propane heater blamed in 2 deaths at RV park

So what makes the espar better as far as carbon monoxide poisoning compared to a suburban propane heater?

-greg
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Old 02-18-2010, 02:33 PM   #12
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Re: Propane heater blamed in 2 deaths at RV park

Greg,

Don't know the difference. Since I was thinking of deleting the propane, we need some type of heat.

Ray
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Old 02-18-2010, 03:49 PM   #13
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Re: Propane heater blamed in 2 deaths at RV park

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Originally Posted by Scalf77
So what makes the espar better as far as carbon monoxide poisoning compared to a suburban propane heater?

-greg
I suspect there is no difference as far as carbon monoxide goes. I imagine that it all comes down to the venting of the unit. If either is not vented properly then either is deadly.

Anyone else know?

steve
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Old 02-18-2010, 06:20 PM   #14
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Re: Propane heater blamed in 2 deaths at RV park

I would assume the Espar has direct, dedicated venting to the outside, or at least I would hope so. Aside from engine heat and an electric mattress warmer, I have no other heat source, so it's quite likely I have no idea what I'm talking about.


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Old 02-18-2010, 08:55 PM   #15
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Re: Propane heater blamed in 2 deaths at RV park

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Originally Posted by BroncoHauler
I would assume the Espar has direct, dedicated venting to the outside.
Herb
As does my propane furnace. And any other propane furnace.

It is hard to imagine the failure that caused this calamity. I suppose the burner tube could have been rusted through to the interior.

But, it probably takes a hard walled RV to buildup enough CO.

An SMB with the penthouse up would be difficult to buildup enough CO. The gas vapor pressures are high enough to cause the CO to flow through the softwall of the penthouse. Maybe the reflectix type materials used for insulation could cause a problem. Or a hardtop style SMB.

Before you ask, I worked for many years in a chemical analysis industry. We could (and did) measure the dissolved gases in liquids. It was incredible how quickly gases would permeate through seemily solid tubing and contaminate liquids that had been purged of dissolved gases. 1/32" solid, extruded FEP teflon would only slow down the rate. It took solid metal tubing to stop the gases from passing through the tubing.

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Old 02-18-2010, 09:03 PM   #16
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Re: Propane heater blamed in 2 deaths at RV park

Since the original article is pretty light on details "propane heater" could just as easily meant a non-vented "Buddy" style heater.
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Old 02-19-2010, 07:15 AM   #17
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Re: Propane heater blamed in 2 deaths at RV park

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Originally Posted by surfgeek33
Sad stories....now i'm really considering deleting propane on our next build. Darn! now I have to work some OT to pay for the Espar.

Ray
Ray, I apologize, I interrupted your post and a previous one revering to Espar, as an indication that they were in someway safer in regards to carbon monoxide poisoning. I was just probing, as to why that could be.

Everybody, thanks for your responses.

-greg
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Old 02-19-2010, 10:01 AM   #18
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Re: Propane heater blamed in 2 deaths at RV park

It doesn't sound as if it was a typical RV setup. It appears the couple was in a cargo trailer with a portable propane heater. Still, with safety in mind, I think it seems cheap and easy to put in a CO alarm and give it a quick check when you are using your heater. I do like the idea of using a 12v heated pad or blanket while you sleep.

http://www.kltv.com/Global/story.asp?S=11951780
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Old 02-19-2010, 10:48 AM   #19
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Re: Propane heater blamed in 2 deaths at RV park

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scalf77
.....Ray, I apologize, I interrupted ........-greg
Greg, No need to apologize, I was also curious about what people say about the Espar and carbon monoxide poisoning.

Ray
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Old 02-19-2010, 12:33 PM   #20
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Re: Propane heater blamed in 2 deaths at RV park

Sorry to here about anybody dying like that. I carry a small portable CO detector as a backup even though I agree with Mike and believe that the PH is vented enough to worry about a heater (even the buddy heater). But I usually crack a window provided itís not too cold out and thatís more for personal preference than Carbon Monoxide. The heaters I really worry about are those old white gas Coleman catalectic heaters. Those things always scared me. Sometimes if they didnít get a good light the fumes would almost knock you off your feet. I donít know if I was smelling CO though.
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