Propane, Tunnels, and is my Propex install worth the hassle?

[jage]

Three things, first ask again. The guy you talked to might have heard "I'm throwing a propane tank in the vehicle." as opposed to permanently installed propane tank. Are there restrictions on RVs? Slide in campers? Most of both have propane, either permanent or refillable tanks.

Second, don't lie, but don't mention it. If they ask on the 100th time, you can always take your lumps and go the long way after that. If my brush with airport security in Orlando is any indication, well the terror threat orange is not being taken seriously after nine years (Hey buddy, how about looking at me too and not just the drivers license?)

Last, and IMHO most important, my van has a big diamond shaped "PROPANE" sticker on the rear corner. I don't know what the legal ramifications are, but this is important for your safety and the safety of firefighters and police who might come to your aid- it's already not obvious that these vans have a propane tank and in an accident or vehicle fire it could be very important information. Further hiding the tank to avoid bridge inspection is compounding this problem.

I'd look into it first though, maybe all you need is an inspection by a competent propane dealer after install or something- and be clear it's an RV thing, not like throwing the grill in the pickup truck bed.

Good luck!

[Motomedic]

While I live on the other side of the country, what I have found, and no offense intended to any of you who fall into this category, is that most of the guys working the trenches don't understand all of the nuances and interpretations of the rules they are tasked to enforce. In reality, there are way too many restrictions for them to understand all of them. If they hit the high spots, they're good, if you know what I mean. It's the same with me as a wrench. I can't remember all of the details of all of the motorcycles I work on. I do try to remember where I can find the info I need.

So, what I would suggest is to investigate the law a bit more thoroughly than asking the foot soldiers (again, no offense intended to anyone). Ask for a printed copy of the restrictions, talk to supervisors, etc. After all, not only are we talking about RV's with propane, but what about propane-fueled vehicles? Buses fueled with LNG? There are lots of pressurized fuel systems running around on our roads, so many that a ban on them for "fire prevention" would seem kinda silly.

[WVvan]

Time for a little research.

On the web page for the Port Authority of NY & NJ Traffic Restrictions is a link to this pdf document: Hazardous Materials Transportation Regulations at Tunnel and Bridge Facilities (the "Red Book")

Page 13:


Notice the * for Materials of Trade.

Page 33:


Page 34:


If I'm reading all this correctly, RV's with propane "in a permanently mounted tank" holding less than 220 pounds are allowed.

Aren't most RV tanks below that limit?

From page 7 of the Port Authority Traffic Rules and Regulations (the "Green Book").

"RECREATIONAL VEHICLES – Shall mean highway vehicles
including one piece motor homes and travel
trailers designed to serve as a temporary dwelling with
single rear wheels. RVs having 3 or more axles with
single rear wheels are considered class 7 vehicles. RVs
having dual rear wheels are considered trucks and are
charged an extra fee per axle."

On the last page of Rules and Regulations.
"For Information call: -
Customer Connections 1-800-221-9903"


PS. Also found this. Good to know, I guess.

[jage]

Originally Posted by WVvan

Dang, there goes the solar panel alternative!

[Rockman]

Yep, and the new SMB Delorean

[Nomadcat]

1. Jeremiah, thanks for the advice. I think it's reasonable. I'd also forgotten about the propane sticker.

2. Dave, thanks for the research and for making me laugh out loud on a rather glum day. Dang! Just when I was about to order the plutonium Webasto, you have to go dig up that obscure regulation.

3. I think you guys may have swayed me to keep going with the Propex install.

Now, I just need for this snow to melt. In NYC, when we get a ton of snow - and the plows are now making mountains of it at every intersection, as well as literally burying some cars in it if you happen to be parked on the wrong side of the street - when this happens, there are two strategies for getting rid of it. You either wait for it to warm up - and this may be happening over the next few days. OR, and they'll probably start this tomorrow, we get front loaders scooping it up into dump trucks and just backing up to the Hudson River. I always wonder what all that rock salt does to the river, but I guess the old Hudson has seen worse.

Besides, they dump it below what's called the "salt line," which is an ever-changing line that marks where the salt water ends and the fresh water begins. It's because of this salt/fresh combination that New York Harbor - way back when, at least - had the greatest oyster beds on the East Coast. The salt line is above the GW Bridge, so I'll probably be passing near it every time I now have to drive my propex-heated van over the upper level.

Paul

[WVvan]

Beside Paul, Everything I know about NYC and the snow comes from the internet.

NYC Tow Truck Crashes Into Parked Car On Street

Warning. Bad language.

[bettyford]

You should just move to Wyoming They hardlly care about anything.
and we dont have any Tunnels just Ice caves.

Merry Xmas Paul
Ron

[Nomadcat]

Ah, yes, Dave...God Bless New York. That made me chuckle.

And Ron, I love the West. I'm hoping I can find a way to get out there and stay out there for more than a few weeks every year.

Paul

[Nomadcat]

So much for the Bridge and Tunnel Authority.

Based on what Dave mentioned and then on their own "Red Book," which I downloaded and read, it certainly looked like you could take an RV with propane through.

When I called the number and got a human, though, his response was "No propane." I told him about the Red Book, described the situation, etc, and he responded very automaton-like "No propane at all, no compressed gases, not in any form, not even the 'camping cylinders'," whatever he meant by that.

Anyway, you cannot fight city hall, as they say.

I'll either go through with it or re-examine the Webasto option and think about ebaying the propex, but at the moment I am a bit deflated.

Maybe I'll just develop a new appreciation for the GW Bridge, as I may be seeing a lot of it.

p