Sourcing custom leafsprings is hard

[WhitH]

You’ll get 1-2 inches in front but ideally you’ll have springs made that account for that so you don’t need any sort of lift block.

[arctictraveller]

You might consider installing the Agile kit first, then measuring the amount of lift you want in the rear before ordering from Alcan.

[Zappo]

Here is another resource for leaf springs and they have great prices/good quality products/not affiliated

https://www.generalspringkc.com/Default.asp

I just had a pair of heavy duty leafs 4/1 installed 0n my 2007 f150 supercrew 4x4 Monday and they are rated 500 lbs each higher than my sagging oem 2/1with helper springs/new shackles/new bolts for leafs/new bushings/new u-bolts for $600 shipped.i waited a few days before mentioning their name because I wanted to make sure I was happy,they have eliminated body roll issue I had and back of truck sitting a little low.they sell leafs for all vans and are very knowledgeable/good customer service and everything showed up right the first time! They even caught something I missed needing longer ubolts because of thicker leaf pack

[nemesisnight]

Originally Posted by Mr.Anderson

Quick question for those who have done the RIP kit - since I'm going with a custom rear leaf spring through Alcans springs and the Agile offroad RIP kit on the front, does anyone know how much lift there is if any from the RIP front suspension - I'm guessing that I will need to make sure I get a leveling spacer for that same height on the leaf springs right?

Assuming you are getting a RIP kit for a Quigley 4x4 then it will raise your front 2" over the 4" you get from the conversion so 6" over stock. Agile also makes a nice spring pack for $1200 that eliminates the rear lift block. Its a little more than Alcan but they have a ton of experience with how to get the springs right the first time and it will match your kit perfectly, I just got some custom to my weight and they are very beefy and heavy duty (its a 8 spring pack). Besides the sway issues I am having at speed my suspension feels great on and offroad.
If you go with Alcan I would do about 6 1/2" over stock for a progressive pack to have the rear a teeny bit higher and allow for any settling like Arctictraveller had or any additional weight when loaded up. If that is bad advice someone feel free to correct me.

[Mr.Anderson]

Originally Posted by nemesisnight

Assuming you are getting a RIP kit for a Quigley 4x4 then it will raise your front 2" over the 4" you get from the conversion so 6" over stock. ...
If you go with Alcan I would do about 6 1/2" over stock for a progressive pack to have the rear a teeny bit higher and allow for any settling like Arctictraveller had or any additional weight when loaded up. If that is bad advice someone feel free to correct me.

That sounds about right to me, I would rather have the rear higher than lower than the front.



Question about the weight since they will be designing the spings based on how much weight is anticipted over the rear axel. I did a quick estimate of my build out items and ballparkish it came out to being around 1100lbs of added hardware for the build as well as gear while on the road. This number doesn't include passenger weight if (which I'm guessing it shouldn't?)



Right now my rig is empty and sitting at 6860 lbs total, with 3060 of that over the rear axle (again its a complete shell right now, I have a lot of work to do with the build this summer).



Should I overestimate the added build weight by another 500lbs or for people who have done builds and measured before / after weight does 1100lbs sound about right? Obviously it would very a lot build by build but this is just estimating the big items (solar + aux battery, water, cabinets, insulation, flooring, food + gear while on a trip)

[arctictraveller]

UPDATE: It's been a couple years since the rear springs were installed and about a year for the fronts. The rears were ordered over the phone and shipped, but I drove to Alcan to have them measure the fronts to make sure the ride height was correct. From the beginning, the rears were a bit low, and once the new fronts were installed, the the front was higher and the rear looked even lower. At the time, the thought was that the fronts would sag somewhat, leveling the van out, but after many thousands of miles on dirt and washboard it became clear they were not going to settle much. After several discussions with the owner of Alcan, there were two options, either remove a leaf in front or add a spacer in the rear. I opted for the easy route and added a 1 inch spacer in the rear (just a couple short pieces of spring). That brought the rear up a bit, but not enough. Since then I've just lived with the saggy butt and all the ribbing it brought from my friends, but since I'm now replacing the rear diff and had the springs out anyway, I had several more conversations with the shop. At first he was reluctant to discuss it further and often times wouldn't return my phone calls, but he finally stepped up to the plate and agreed to do something. We discussed adding additional leaf's or a spacer that I could do at home, but ultimately I decided to ship them back to him. Once he inspects them (he lost the build card so had no idea how they were made) he's going to call to determine where we go from here. Additionally, one of the bushings has worked it's way out of the spring eye allowing the spring to rub on the shackle and the only way to fix that here at home was to try some epoxy, not a fix I wanted. So, he should get the springs next week and from there we can determine what's next. I will say that the ride was fine, better than stock, but the ride height was too far off. Then, there's the shipping cost, $250 a pair one way. I'm hoping he will cover return shipping, but it hasn't been discussed yet. Stand by..............

[arctictraveller]

I thought I would post an update, mostly because I've received a couple follow up questions by PM . The rear of the van continued to be lower than the front, so while discussing this with Bill, the owner at Alcan, he said to just install some spacers, and sent a couple short pieces of spring that brought the rear up about an inch, but it still wasn't level with the front. Fast forward a year or so, and I drove out to Alcan to get new front springs. I wanted him to measure them to make sure there were no mistakes. It took about a week to get them made, and once finished a nearby shop installed them. While the van was on the rack, we noticed one of the rear spring bushings had moved out of the spring eye and was rubbing on the front mount. The next thing we noticed was that the front was now even higher than before, so I went back to Alcan to discuss this issue. Bill said the front would settle, so give it a chance to level out. Fast forward thousands of miles, and the front was still much higher, so I again contacted Bill, who was less than totally cooperative, (he had trouble returning phone messages and emails) but eventually he agreed there was a mistake somewhere, and after discussing the options (add another leaf to the rear at the cost of a higher spring rate or, add more spacers which would increase axle wrap, exactly the opposite of what I was trying to accomplish by removing the lift blocks) he decided he would fix the rears if I would send them in which I did, (at my expense of nearly $250 ea way) He wasn't specific on what he planned to do, but once I got them back, I could see that he had re-arched the top two leafs on one side, but only one leaf on the other side. The bushings were pressed back into place and on one side, there was a little tac weld holding it in place, but on the other side, the bushing was sticking out by about an inch, enough that it wouldn't fit into the hanger. A few taps with a hammer and it slid right back into the proper place, but it is pretty loose. Now the van was level, but my shocks were too short due to the increased lift. Shortly after installing the springs but before solving the shock issue, I found a full float and replaced the semi float. The shocks were still too short, and I ended up getting a set of longer Fox remote reservoir's. So, in summery, getting the ride height correct was a lot of work, and an added expense of nearly $500 in freight, and another nearly $500 in shocks, (in addition to many hours of my labor). The returned springs contained an different number of re-arched leaf's on each side, and the bushings were still loose in the eye. Lastly, Bill wasn't really interested in doing anything under warranty, but after several emails, and lots of photos he requested, he finally agreed to fix them, but did what I consider a half ass job. Yes, they were not as expensive as Deaver, delivery was much faster, and the ride is good but if I had to do it over, I'm not sure I would go the same route. YMMV.

[mgmetalworks]

This thread is like a checklist of all the reasons I don't want to get into the business of custom leaf springs. It isn't difficult to come up with specifications but in my experience, it's very difficult to find a spring shop that can deliver what you ask for, especially in a one-off scenario.

Thanks for sharing.

[boywonder]

I replaced the stock E-350 rear leafs with a used set from an ambulance....many more leafs but in the end the rate wasn't much different.


They did allow me to run shorter lift blocks though since they had roughly double the leaf count. The ambulance spring bushings were quite tired, and I replaced them with aftermarket urethane bushings....I don't remember it being too big of a job to replace those...but it's been a few years.


They've been working fine since then. I do recall calling Deaver about rear leafs and one thing I remember them saying is that the springs are designed to be flat under load...which seems somewhat counter-intuitive to many of us. The ambulance springs are also pretty much flat when loaded with the weight of the van.

[arctictraveller]

Another update: It turns out that the former owner of Alcan sold the business right after returning my rear springs. In chatting with a former employee, it seems he did some less than stellar work at the end of his ownership as he was more focused on selling the business and getting out of town. Since reinstalling the reworked springs, the rear has settled a bit and is now lower than the front again. So, I called and chatted with the new owner. I explained that I didn't expect him to be responsible for work produced prior to his taking over and in light of the fact that it's been way past the warranty period, but what did he think? We discussed possible repairs, and he said once i sent him accurate weights, he would devise a solution. It sounds like he's willing to supply the parts at no charge too, due to the ongoing issues I've had, so I'd have to say that I'm happily surprised and hopeful that under new ownership Alcan will return to providing a quality product at a reasonable price.