House battery performance?

TraceyAZ · 11-26-2014, 11:42 AM

Just a quick question about how long and what the voltage should be able to hang at for a house battery, group 4d 200ish amp hour I believe is what its rated at.
The back story here is that I was noticing some very slow cranking when I was starting my van (2005 6.0) so I dropped the starting batteries off the side frame rail. When I got them down it was VERY apparent that I had a SERIOUS issue. The batteries had more corrosion on them, that I had ever seen in my life on any battery I've ever come across. HUGE chunks of solid blue so bad that one positive post had been forced up and out of the battery case. The one battery I did take out intact and had tested (the better looking one) failed the test instantly. The other battery I had to carefully cut the positive post off then work on the clamp with the battery out of the way to free the post from the clamp.
So new batteries in, clamps and cables cleaned very well, all back together the van starts like its got turbo batteries. lol
Now I got to thinking about this, if those batteries were shot then my van was being started off the house battery, pure the way the battery isolator (1315?) is hooked up from sportsmobile? Would that sort of abuse wreck a relatively new Life line house battery? The van is stored inside a climate controlled garage and after everything is fully charged and I park it the house battery will quickly start to have voltage fall off. Within about 3 days it goes from 13 plus volts down to 12.4ish 12.5ish with noting more than a couple of very small led indicators that stay on constant from the solar charge controller and carbon monoxide detector. This seems like to short of a time with to little of a draw to effect that sort of battery like that?
So I just wanted to ask the opinion of others here. Can you load test that sort of a battery? Should I start shopping for a new house battery? What is your thoughts on the usage?
Thank you everyone.
Tracey

mikracer · 11-26-2014, 11:51 AM

I was under the impression that if your house battery is isolated, then it will not act as a starting battery unless you have an additional switch of some sort that will connect it to the starting batteries. Do you have a switch that connects it to your starting battery?

If it is truly isolated, the only connection between the house battery and the starting battery is that it is getting its charge from the alternator when the motor is running (as is the starting batteries).

TraceyAZ · 11-26-2014, 12:15 PM

Maybe, but for some reason I thought that I had read here that those sure1315 isolators were hooked up in such a way that if the start batteries fail that it is automatically switched by the 1315 and that the thread I was reading that was the big complaint about them, how would you know if you had bad starting batteries? This was the reason some folks were swapping theirs out with a different brand?
I could be wrong...it wouldn't be the first time. lol
Tracey

mikracer · 11-26-2014, 01:14 PM

I think its just the terminology thats confusing me. It looks like the 1315 is a separator and not an isolator. And based on this very thorough post (http://www.sportsmobileforum.com/viewto ... =14&t=8842) the separator allows current from the house battery to assist in starting the van when the starter batteries drop below a certain point.

Maybe your house battery has been doing most of the starting duties for a while now and its getting tired. Not sure if the local autozone could load test it, but based on your description of how bad your starter batteries were, it might be time for a new house battery. You could also try charging it with a battery charger and see if it holds charge a little better. One with a desulfator might help.

Viva · 11-26-2014, 01:56 PM

I think that was called "start assist" mode, but I don't like it because (as you may have found out), your start bank can go bad without you realizing it as the house bank "silently" takes over. Ugh! I'm in the process of re-wiring my rig and am not going to have that "feature" in my new plan (my Surepower 1315 is on the recall list, so all the more reason.)

I'm actually debating between installing the Blue Sea 7622 I have, or just going with a manual switch. I'm leaning toward the manual switch for a few reasons (perhaps you could say "quirks

)

1) I'm used to remembering to do things like this from boating.

2) I like the idea of my default arrangement being that the start and house banks have nothing to do with each other.

3) I can the choose to "combine" the banks if my house bank needs charging and I am driving for awhile.

4) I watch my house bank like a hawk when I'm parked (battery monitors), so even if there were a time I forgot and left them combined, I think I should still have enough voltage to start because I don't draw the house bank below 50% (not that this would be the way I'd intend to run things, but it's good to have a workable plan if I forget to un-combine).

5) I have ordered an Anti-Gravity jump start pack for "situations." A friend has one and we started his V-10 (what I have) the other day three times with it and it still had almost all of its charge (granted it was not cold weather). Pretty amazing (and will charge electronic "devices" too).

I may decide to put in the 7622, but my current leaning is toward just a manual switch. The way I have my battery bank set up I would be able to reach the combine switch from the driver's seat (would be on forward facing side of gaucho). I would plan to leave it un-combined except for specific driving days when I wanted to charge the house bank from the alternator.

Feel free to shoot my idea down, anyone - I may be missing something. And I do have the 7622...

REF · 11-26-2014, 03:38 PM

Also-your original batteries sound like they were flooded or wet cell, I would recommend if you didn't already, replace them with some AGM batteries. They are maintenance free and tend to handle the abuse we throw at them better.

TraceyAZ · 11-26-2014, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Viva

I think that was called "start assist" mode, but I don't like it because (as you may have found out), your start bank can go bad without you realizing it as the house bank "silently" takes over. Ugh! I'm in the process of re-wiring my rig and am not going to have that "feature" in my new plan (my Surepower 1315 is on the recall list, so all the more reason.)

Yep I found out long after it was to late, my start batteries were long shot. What Im more upset with is not to long before this I was getting some minor work done for some unrelated stuff and specifically asked the shop to drop the batteries and load test them. From the amount of corrosion Im positive they would have at least found that issue starting let alone let me know what shape those batteries were in.

TraceyAZ · 11-26-2014, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by REF

Also-your original batteries sound like they were flooded or wet cell, I would recommend if you didn't already, replace them with some AGM batteries. They are maintenance free and tend to handle the abuse we throw at them better.

Yes the old batteries were the flooded type. They were Bosch batteries, can't say that I have seen that brand for automotive applications before.
The AGM type of batteries were on my list, but there seemed to be some chatter about them not being appropriate for starting batteries? Some said yes others said no. I went with what I know works and has a good warranty. lol
I guess Im dropping a house battery soon, hey at least its easier than the start batteries on the frame rail.

**daveb** · 11-26-2014, 06:04 PM

The separator should have kept the house safe from discharge but unfortunately it won't protect it from overcharging. Still I wonder if you haven't just pulled the battery down. I'd suggest that you put the battery on a good hard charge for a few days, then do a load test. Maybe you'll get lucky. The Surepower separators installed by SMB in the day did combine during vehicle start and SMB cut in a momentary push button switch so it wasn't masking poor starting battery issues. It was an upgrade on the 2006 models.

**daveb** · 11-27-2014, 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TraceyAZ

Quote:

Originally Posted by REF

Also-your original batteries sound like they were flooded or wet cell, I would recommend if you didn't already, replace them with some AGM batteries. They are maintenance free and tend to handle the abuse we throw at them better.

Yes the old batteries were the flooded type. They were Bosch batteries, can't say that I have seen that brand for automotive applications before.
The AGM type of batteries were on my list, but there seemed to be some chatter about them not being appropriate for starting batteries? Some said yes others said no. I went with what I know works and has a good warranty. lol
I guess Im dropping a house battery soon, hey at least its easier than the start batteries on the frame rail.

I've been using Odyssey AGM's since 2009 and have not had an issue yet. Before that I was going through flooded type starting batteries on a yearly basis. Nobody has ever been able to confirm that there is a Sears Diehard that's an exact copy (to spec) Odyssey battery, but the PC-1500 look the same (just not red) and Sears has a 4 warranty. The Sears Platinum series is made by EnerSys who puts out Odyssey. EnerSys also is supposed to make Interstate's MT-7 but I've never followed up on it. If you're on the road, Sears is almost everywhere. I'll probably go that route in the future.