MG Metal Works DIY kit knowledge share

[Fork-N-Road]

Originally Posted by winnievan

That being said -- the even if the speedo is off -- I think this shift points for the transmission should remain the same -- which is the more important part -- but I haven't dug into this very deeply

I haven't had a chance to fix my ABS light yet, but near as I can tell, my van speedometer is reading ~6% faster at highway speeds vs. actual GPS speed.

When I am in 4LO, it makes the speedo read even faster than actual speed and I am wondering if the van is still shifting at the appropriate time (I need to watch the RPM where it shifts the next time that I am out, as I am not sure if the shifts are coming from RPM or the speed the van is seeing)

The speed differential also causes my ABS to kick in when I get on the brakes in 4 LO.

[amamdani]

Originally Posted by winnievan

This may just be for the 4r100 -- but...

Mind sharing a link to the u-joint thread where this is discussed? It's always had me curious and I haven't really seen it addressed..

it was a facebook group "ujoint offroad owners user group" and the thread conversation was on driveshafts with 4r100. i think you need to be in the group to see the thread but chris from ujoint advised the op that their ERA box ABxxx had to be connected in order for the trans/ECU to be happy, basically i am paraphrasing. the op was soliciting advice because his rig could only go 3-4mph once driveshafts were connected. in the post above, MG has commented this not an issue for 4r75.

i do plan on doing some type of dual-ERA which i am hoping will be straight forward since I chose the nv273 and have the encoder/computer. but that will be a future project down the line. just trying to get the basics done for now.

[winnievan]

Hey -- does anyone who started with a single steering stabilizer (Fox 985-24-001) that went to a dual stabilizer setup have their old single stabilizer laying in their shop collecting dust?

I just picked up a Kelderman Dual Steering stabilizer bracket and have a single 985-24-001 that I cannot return now that I'd love to pair with another one on the bracketry!

Let me know in PM

[winnievan]

Originally Posted by Fork-N-Road

I haven't had a chance to fix my ABS light yet, but near as I can tell, my van speedometer is reading ~6% faster at highway speeds vs. actual GPS speed.

When I am in 4LO, it makes the speedo read even faster than actual speed and I am wondering if the van is still shifting at the appropriate time (I need to watch the RPM where it shifts the next time that I am out, as I am not sure if the shifts are coming from RPM or the speed the van is seeing)

The speed differential also causes my ABS to kick in when I get on the brakes in 4 LO.

It makes sense this would happen -- I reckon this is why the F250/F350 uses a speed sensor in the rear pinion as opposed to the transmission. It should read exactly 2.72X faster than in 4HI or 2HI.

But they got rid of that speedo sensor in the newer trucks -- but I have no idea where the speedo signal comes from on the trucks without a tone ring in the differential.

Surprised this isn't more documented -- but one could easily install two ERAs connected by a relay -- have 87A connected to the one you use in 2WD/4HI and 87 connected to one you use in 4WD LO.

You will need some of switch that only hits when you are in 4LO to trigger the relay. I think the electronic switch on the NP271 is just to indicate you are in 4WD -- no distinction between 4HI and 4LO, IIRC. You can modify the flag to only trigger in 4LO (something I've done on a previous vehicle) but you need to disassemble the case to do it).

Otherwise -- it is relatively easy to put this switch on the linkage somewhere.
With the ESOF NP273 -- there is probably already a separate 4LO signal.

[Turbo]

Originally Posted by winnievan

Hey -- does anyone who started with a single steering stabilizer (Fox 985-24-001) that went to a dual stabilizer setup have their old single stabilizer laying in their shop collecting dust?

I just picked up a Kelderman Dual Steering stabilizer bracket and have a single 985-24-001 that I cannot return now that I'd love to pair with another one on the bracketry!

Let me know in PM

Winnievan I'm in search of a dual stabilizer setup. If I buy a kit I might have a single 985-24-001. No promises.

What dual stabilizer brackets are folks using? Some brands I've seen.
Kelderman
BDS
RoughCountry
Superlift
PMF

[mgmetalworks]

Jsweezy had a single in his shop sitting there doing nothing last time I was there (a month or so ago). Maybe PM him and see if he still has it.

[winnievan]

Originally Posted by Turbo

Winnievan I'm in search of a dual stabilizer setup. If I buy a kit I might have a single 985-24-001. No promises.

What dual stabilizer brackets are folks using? Some brands I've seen.
Kelderman
BDS
RoughCountry
Superlift

I found some Fabtech Dirt Logic stabilizers on CL for really cheap and paired them up with a Rolling Big Power bracket I got on Amazon Warehouse for $99--which is the same as the Zone Offroad product. The RBP/Zone Offroad unit is definitely at the cheaper end of the spectrum -- but the bracket seemed pretty solid for the price point.

I was pretty stoked -- thought I had an equivalent of a $700 stabilizer system for a steal. Then I rebuilt those Dirt Logic shocks... and when I opened them up they were missing somethign -- they didn't have an Internal Floating Piston (IFP) -- I verified with Fabtech they weren't supposed to have one -- pretty insane for a product Fabtech sells for like $800+ new. So they're just really fancy emulsion shocks (i.e. the gas is mixed with the oil) which really aren't going to work well when mounted horizontally. Emulsion shocks only work properly when mounted vertically -- so with a dual stabilizer you really want an IFP to separate the gas from the fluid in this application.

If you don't know what an IFP is or why it matters in this application -- here's a good read from Carli:
https://carlisuspension.com/what-is-...ng-stabilizer/

So I finished the rebuild and and sold them for a small profit with the bracket kit and traded up to my Kelderman kit with the help of a Black Friyay sale. Many of the brackets look wimpy and there is a lot of force going on around a Dana 60, so I always had my eye on Kelderman given how the beef of their bracketry.

I learned alot during this process and my read is pretty much any of the super low end stuff is going to be junk both in terms of bracket and the included shocks -- skyjacker, rough country, superlift. But even some higher end stuff is going to be junk -- emulsion fabtech is going to be better than the rough country emulsion shocks -- but you want an IFP in this situation, IMO. The Bilstein 5100 is emulsion too -- so stay away from that in this application as well.

There are a ton of units out there -- but

I think this is how I thought about the various options while researching -- and this is only based on the bracketry not the included or recommended shocks:

High-end --
Keldermann : https://kelderman.com/shop/2017-ford...ilizer-bracket
Ikon:
https://iconvehicledynamics.com/acce...tabilizer-kit/
Stryker #1:https://strykerordesign.com/collecti...ing-stabilizer
Stryker #2: https://strykerordesign.com/collecti...ing-stabilizer
Flight Fabrication (only lsted for 2017-2020 -- but I bet it'd work):
https://flightfabrications.com/2017-...tabilizer-kit/
PMF: https://www.pmfsuspension.com/2005-2...-Kit_p_65.html

Medium:
BDS: https://bds-suspension.com/product-d...fox%20steering
Zone Offroad: https://zoneoffroad.com/products/dua...33411023667288

Low-end - Superlift, Rancho, Skyjacker, Procomp, Fabtech...

This is by no means exhaustive -- but that's my read on the market.

I think Kelderman, Flight Fabrication and Stryker 2.0 are the absolute best in this market -- but they are also the most $$$.

If you really want to step it up a notch -- you could pair a dual stabilizer with King or Carli IFP stabilizers -- or go with the Kelderman unit with the custom valved Falcon shocks.

I think there are a millions way to skin this cat -- but, frankly, I choose Kelderman because it is sturdy as all hell and doesn't use U-bolts. The omission of U-bolt was purely asthetic for me. I'm sure cheaper options are out there that would work great. It's also super easy to install on our vans since it goes underneath the tie-rod -- the other one I installed involved me poping the taper on the drag link to get it mounted -- the clearance seemed fine after installation but it does add another step.

As usually, YMMV -- but it does seem like there is a wide variety of steering stabilizers aimed at various price points in the market -- I personally think using IFP shocks/stabilizers in this application is preferable and your money will be better spent getting a solid bracket and pairing some good IFP shocks with it than dropping a bunch of money on the best bracket and then putting some Bilstein 5100 (emulsion) shocks on it.

[Lilnuts2]

Don't mean to be a buzz kill. But shouldn't this have it's own thread in the 4x4 section? Rather then diluting the specific MG metal works share. This thread is getting so long some of the good info is getting buried deeper and deeper, just a thought.

[Turbo]

Originally Posted by Lilnuts2

Don't mean to be a buzz kill. But shouldn't this have it's own thread in the 4x4 section? Rather then diluting the specific MG metal works share. This thread is getting so long some of the good info is getting buried deeper and deeper, just a thought.

I suppose, but the cause for getting the dual stabilizers is because of installing the MG kit. MG specifies the single stabilizer with part numbers but does say dual is recommended with larger tires. However, correctly I'd say due to the large amount of options, does not spec a dual stabilizer setup. Hence why I asked the question, but I do see your point.

[winnievan]

Yeah I'm with Turbo on this -- it seems relevant to the MG kit since it is specific to the Dana Super 60.

Perhaps my post digresses a bit -- but it certainly isn't a road I was planning to take prior to installing the MG kit!

Perhaps a MG DIY Wiki is in order... threads like these always get long -- and then tend to repeat themselves.

I ain't got the time to throw one together -- but it would be nice to have a more organized resource!