Leak at Upper Windshield Corners

[Glider]

JWA, I could not have asked for a better response. Thank you! I'll do my research re installers, and will probably be in touch with you with questions.

[daveb]

Yep I'm in that situation and it will be addressed as soon as I got the money. I was told by a local body shop that some glass people will get the job done right as JWA suggested. After jerks broke into my van at the dealership where they trashed windows (and everything else), the dealership used the cheapest guys in town to make me happy before going out of business. I now have rust.

Great thread.

[JWA]

Thanks for confirming what I'm saying DaveB----installers are the key most times.

I've subscribed to this thread, will pay attention and more quickly reply if needed.

Glider feel free to contact me anytime.


JWA

[sdwindansea]

I thought I had the same problem, but turns out the leak is not from the windshield. I posted about it over here - http://www.sportsmobileforum.com/for...f-18699-2.html

[UnaccomplishedAngler]

This thread, titled Mystery Leak, may be helpful:
http://www.sportsmobileforum.com/for...eak-15455.html

Despite having my roof sprayed with Line-x, and having my windshield replaced by a very well respected glass guy (who found no signs of rust when the windshield was out) it continued to leak. So my next attempt was to use Permatex Flowable Silicone Windshield Sealant. I thought that was the solution because it didn't leak over the course of the summer...until a late season trip last fall when it rained, and the old drip was back. I'm at my wit's end and will try more Permatex this Spring when the van comes out of hibernation.

[Drizzt]

So I've been dealing with this issue as well. And I already fixed the rusted floor shortly after I got the van since the previous owner claimed he had replaced the windshield to fix, but this morning after 4" of rain last night the floor board is wet again...

I can't find where it's coming from exactly, although I can feel it is wet up behind the rubber sheet behind the fuse block. I can also see what seems to be water seeping from the body seams in the wheel well when viewing from the outside (other side is dry on the floor and doesn't have this seeping in the well).

I would assume that since the van hasn't moved in three weeks that it isn't entering through the body seam, but is there any other places it might get in besides the windshield? Like someplace in the cowl?

And several people have noted that if replacing the windshield you need the right person. Having never had to replace a windshield how do you determine a person is qualified for something odd like this? The people I've talked to have never heard of this issue before so I'm leery of spending the money with them to replace something that I am not sure is the problem in the first place...

[JWA]

Hey Drizzt---the best windshield installers don't always work for a large or advertising-happy huge outfit, aka "safelite". If you live or visit places somewhat close to your home ask other van owners if they've had their W/S's replaced and by whom. After a while a consensus of sorts will emerge---that's about the only way I know the typical vehicle owner can go about finding one or two competent installers.

I would offer ANY installer whose been in the business more than a few years saying they've never heard of an E-Series van built after 1992 leaking from the upper W/S corners isn't one I'd recommend. One problem with that body is the A-Pillar and roof have a seam the W/S covers and once it separates leaks will form---a crack if you will that's not visible from the exterior. This crack runs under the W/S adhesive which is where water comes in and typically a well-known issue.

AnnieO here has a 2010 E-Series with a leak that's been discovered on the left (drivers) side in one of the upper body seams below the bottom of the W/S. I've never seen water flowing in that area but having looked at her van it was very evident water was getting in somehow. Bad part about that is the entire left fender has to be removed and body seams resealed with proper materials. This is NOT an easy project for most people.

The leaks you notice and when they leak indicates you have a similar problem to AnnieO's but it would most likely be in a place gravity lets the water flow but not nearest the cowl trim pieces---they're nothing more than trim that isn't typically involved in front-of-cabin leaks.

Lastly any leak needs to first be identified and located before sealing is possible---this is truly the most difficult part. As in AnnieO's left fender leak we ran water on it long enough to see a leak, at least by my guessestimation----obviously a longer testing time was necessary.

If this doesn't answer your questions please follow up with more---kinda tough to know what to advise when I can't see the leaks for myself.

J W

[Drizzt]

Originally Posted by JWA

a leak that's been discovered on the left (drivers) side in one of the upper body seams below the bottom of the W/S. I've never seen water flowing in that area but having looked at her van it was very evident water was getting in somehow.

How did you determine it was coming from the cowl rather than the windshield? From what I've seen thus far (haven't taken anything on the exterior apart yet) I don't see a way to differentiate between something running down the A-pillar onto the floorboard and something else; it looks like it all would gravity flow down the firewall, over the fender well and into the foot well.

I'm going to try using a water hose and set it on the cowl first and see if I get any water inside, then move it up the A-pillar in increments until I hopefully see something. With it coming down the firewall and all the crap up in there, I don't see another way to try and isolate the location without major teardown of the dash unless somebody has a better solution.

Thanks!

[JWA]

If I understand AnnieO's response to this same question I posed to her the leaking side panels was observed by her glass installer/repairman. (Don't take that as the gospel truth, my memory is always subject to doubt. )

In her case the leak would present itself by drops of water on top of the left side driver's floor mat and show signs of accumulated dust under the dash having been wet enough to drip, a few drops maybe laying on the floor mat. That alone tends to indicate the leak isn't from the upper A-Pillars---those leaks can and do run down inside the trim panels which cannot be seen. Once the water is below the actual dashboard it runs under the factory floor mat along inner pieces of sheet metal.

In order to observe the upper corner leaks you'll have to run a hose for quite some time while craning your neck to see if water is running. Another option is using some sort of inspection mirror which shows the area where the W/S is bonded to the body. Another "better" option is to simply remove the A-Pillar trim completely. Any year past 2002 does have the grab handles which obviously need to be removed first.

Your planned process of starting low the moving upwards is exactly correct--its how I do it too. A steady stream from the hose without a nozzle or other squiring device is preferred---rain typically isn't driven as much as it lands on something then flows toward gravity. If you don't see a leak immediately keep the water running in for upwards of 10-15 minutes at the bottom.

Once you're ready to move towards the top its okay to spray all across the top looking for leaks there---at this point we're not too concerned with the A-Pillar exterior. If no leaks across the top that's good news.

Testing the A-Pillar is somewhat easy----position the running water stream so it flows down the pillar from the top, water stream positioned just inboard slightly to test 2-3" as well as down the full length of the W/S. This too could take upwards of 10-15 minutes before a leak can be seen.

At this point re-check under the dash again---by now if a leak is present in the area below the W/S cowl area it should show up now.

Lemme know if I can help further.

[arctictraveller]

A technique I have used in the past on boats involves using a blower of the type used to dry wet carpet, remove smoke from structure fires, ventilate tanks and manholes, or just provide a ton of ventilation. They come in both round and rectangular shapes, normally have large hoses attached, and can be rented from many rental shops. Using cardboard and tape, (blue painters tape will release easily after you finish) fabricate a piece that fits a window, with a cut out for the discharge hose. Using more tape or cardboard, cover all obvous places where air could escape, like dash vents, heater vents etc. The idea is to pressurize the interior of the van, then using a spray bottle with soapy water, spray suspected leak areas and look for bubbles.