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Old 12-15-2009, 09:54 PM   #11
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Re: **Sold**Bully Dog Triple Dog Programmer For Sale

Here in CA you will fail your smog inspection if they can see you have added any performance parts. If you have the Edge guages with something wired in you might run into issues. No one knows how it will all work out until they start doing them. This is good for now. It has higher power levels, but I dont even need to go there. It seems to of filled my needs right off the bat. I do have to disagree about warranty issues. The downloader will work on both my SMB and my Dodge, but I will not install on my Dodge yet. The dodge is still under warranty, and I wont lift or screw with it until it is out(next year). I have had trucks in the past and had warranty issues denied because of lifts. I dont know what it will do for my dodge considering it has the high output engine with a manual, but we will see(next year)!
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Old 12-15-2009, 10:39 PM   #12
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Re: **Sold**Bully Dog Triple Dog Programmer For Sale

SMBDAD,

Sorry to hear that, but if you would have put up a fight, they will or would have to fix whatever issues you had "if" it was/is under factory warranty, it's the law, (check out your fine print in the warranty book). They would/will have to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that whatever you did caused the failure, very hard to do. I have been the Automotive industry as a dealer for over 18 years & own a dealership, I'm very aware of what manufacturers/dealers will & can try to do, customer pay, pays them (Dealer) a lot more then warranty work, thats why they try to get claims waived, trust me, it's how a lot of dealers operate, they difference can be 70-80 % increase to their bottom line. If they tell you "no" a few times most if not all people give up, money in their pocket. The reason why Dodge, Ford & Chevy haven't done it themselves I.E. controllers in the diesels is because of making things 50 state legal, but remember smog is different in each state, we also have to get our cars smog'ed every other year. I've had my controller on each one of my vehicles (as I said, All of them under warranty) and have never not passed smog or been denied any warranty work, thats with each manufacture. All I've even done is to just return it to stock before they test it, normally I do it in there parking lot just before going in (dealer or smog test), but again, thats just me and my 2 cents.

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Old 12-15-2009, 10:55 PM   #13
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Re: **Sold**Bully Dog Triple Dog Programmer For Sale

If your dealer tells you cannot warranty a factory component he is lying, if you think a dealer will not lie to you I have ocean front property for sale here in colorado for cheap with your name written all over it!!! A simple google search will tell you they have to stand behind their warranty.
I pulled this off of the net. It is called Magnuson-Moss Act this is a statement from gale banks regarding dealer warranties.


FANNING FEARS

You want to upgrade your vehicle with aftermarket equipment, but you're worried about putting the vehicle's warranty at risk. It's no wonder. How many times have you heard someone at a dealership say that installing aftermarket equipment automatically voids the warranty? This common misconception has been repeated often enough to be widely believed - even though it is completely false.

Wrap-up: Dealers don't like warranty work, which pays less than normal repairs. By promoting the myth that aftermarket equipment automatically voids warranties, some dealers manage to avoid such low-paying work and charge the prime rate for service which is rightfully under warranty.

THE TRUTH

Most vehicle owners are not aware they are protected by federal law: the Magnuson-Moss Warranty - Federal Trade Commission Improvement Act of 1975. Under the Magnuson-Moss Act, aftermarket equipment which improves performance does not void a vehicle manufacturer's original warranty, unless the warranty clearly and conspicuously states that aftermarket equipment voids the warranty. Most states have warranty statutes, as well, which provide further protections for vehicle owners.

In other words, a dealer can't wiggle out of his legal warranty obligation merely because you install aftermarket equipment. To find out if any aftermarket equipment automatically voids your vehicle's warranty, check the owner's manual, usually under a heading such as "What Is Not Covered." Although the language may be negative, remember your vehicle manufacturer is simply saying he does not cover the aftermarket products themselves. He is not saying that the products would void the vehicle warranty.

(Separately sold "extended" warranties vary and may be subject to restrictions not addressed here.)

Wrap-up: As of the 1998 model year, no properly installed equipment manufactured by Gale Banks Engineering has ever voided any vehicle manufacturer's warranty. And, to protect your investment, Banks warranties every power product they manufacture.

VEHICLE DEALERS' OBLIGATIONS

Suppose your modified vehicle needs repairs while still under warranty. Without analyzing the true cause of the problem, the dealer attempts to deny warranty coverage. He made his decision simply based on the fact that you've installed aftermarket equipment - a convenient way to dodge low-paying warranty work.

An example of how ridiculous this can get is the man who was denied warranty coverage by a dealer on his power door locks, because he had improved his exhaust system! Sounds nuts? It really happened - because that man did not know his rights and challenge the dealer's decision.

Wrap-up: A dealer must prove - not just say - that aftermarket equipment caused the need for repairs before he can deny warranty coverage on that basis.

YOUR RIGHTS

Point out to the dealer the provisions of the Magnuson-Moss Act. Require that he explain to you how the aftermarket equipment caused the problem. If he can't - or his explanation sounds questionable - it is your legal right to demand he comply with the warranty.

Wrap-up: If you are still being unfairly denied warranty coverage, there is recourse. The Federal Trade Commission, which administers the Magnuson-Moss Act, monitors compliance with warranty law. Direct complaints to the FTC at (202) 326-3128.
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Old 12-15-2009, 11:29 PM   #14
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Re: **Sold**Bully Dog Triple Dog Programmer For Sale

There are a number of issues here.

Aftermarket parts CAN void a warranty. The Magnuson-Moss Act was put in place to prevent the automobile makers from requiring you to use factory parts. As long as a non-OEM part meets the specs (in whose eyes, I don't know) that part can be used. A part that performs to different specifications (e.g. a "performance" part), IF it can be shown to be the cause of a failure of a factory part, will void the warranty. But the real bottom-line is that a Dealership can void your warranty, and then you would have to go to court to prove otherwise. I don't know about you, but even a bailout-less Ford has much deeper pockets than I do.

If I add performance parts, even providing that something like a tuner is undectable, and the increased horsepower (e.g. increased boost) were to cause a failure like a head gasket leak ( a not uncommon failure in high performance 6.0L's), and then I remove the tuner, should I expect Ford to honor the warranty? Seems a bit unethical to me. On the otherhand, If I have a A/C compressor failure, they shouldn't care if I have sixteen hamsters on a treadmill under the hood.

FWIW, there are quite a few Ford techs on The DieselStop.com and the consensus sure seems to be that if they want to look for it, they can show hard data that a tuner has been installed on your vehicle.

Performance parts on just fine on a California vehicle if they have CARB approval.


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Old 12-15-2009, 11:58 PM   #15
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Re: **Sold**Bully Dog Triple Dog Programmer For Sale

I do not own a dealership, wish I was that fortunate. Lets take a lift and bigger tires on a truck for example. The truck from the factory has a tire size specified. Now you go lift that truck and put 35's on it. You have exceeded the manufacturers specifications. You have put added stress on steering components, braking components, transmission. The list goes on and on. They will not cover it! As Bronco hauler said, they have much deeper pockets than I.

I was checking out a new dodge truck the other night. Brand new. The owner is telling me how it is warranteed for life. He can pass it on to his kids, just cant sell or warranty is void. Interesting part was they would not do that for the diesel just gas. My guess they know the tranny will give at some point with the diesel. All I could think is that guy cant change a flippen thing on that truck for life.
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Old 12-16-2009, 08:10 AM   #16
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Re: **Sold**Bully Dog Triple Dog Programmer For Sale

Your killing me!!! So every truck that comes from a dealer with lift and big tires is not warrantied??? And this guy buy a new dodge truck from a company that just filed for bankrupt and your telling me it has a life time warranty?? Riiigght. Trucks do not come with a lift time warranty ask any dealer. Now back to your question about lift and tires your answer is no no no. If this were the case you would never see a new lifted truck on a lot for sale you see it all the time. If the dealer wanted to say you put added stress on your truck because of oversized tires then he would also void any other warrenty item because you must of used your truck wrong like towed to much weight or put to big of a camper on it or your to fat so I won't warranty the broken seat I could go on and on do your research if you really think dodge trucks come with a life time warranty. He probably had the same sales man you had and the sales man left out the rust part yes they come with a lifetime rust protection warranty.
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Old 12-16-2009, 08:14 AM   #17
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Re: **Sold**Bully Dog Triple Dog Programmer For Sale

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronco_hauler
There are a number of issues here.

Aftermarket parts CAN void a warranty. The Magnuson-Moss Act was put in place to prevent the automobile makers from requiring you to use factory parts. As long as a non-OEM part meets the specs (in whose eyes, I don't know) that part can be used. A part that performs to different specifications (e.g. a "performance" part), IF it can be shown to be the cause of a failure of a factory part, will void the warranty. But the real bottom-line is that a Dealership can void your warranty, and then you would have to go to court to prove otherwise. I don't know about you, but even a bailout-less Ford has much deeper pockets than I do.

If I add performance parts, even providing that something like a tuner is undectable, and the increased horsepower (e.g. increased boost) were to cause a failure like a head gasket leak ( a not uncommon failure in high performance 6.0L's), and then I remove the tuner, should I expect Ford to honor the warranty? Seems a bit unethical to me. On the otherhand, If I have a A/C compressor failure, they shouldn't care if I have sixteen hamsters on a treadmill under the hood.

FWIW, there are quite a few Ford techs on The DieselStop.com and the consensus sure seems to be that if they want to look for it, they can show hard data that a tuner has been installed on your vehicle.

Performance parts on just fine on a California vehicle if they have CARB approval.


Herb
I'm with Herb on this one. To battle a dealer who tries to deny a warranty claim you need a lot of TIME and perhaps also some money if lawyers get involved. I barely have the time to get my vehicles in for maintenance, let alone major work. So while I may be 'right', my own cost/benefit matrix leads me to avoid any time-consuming hassles with a dealer.
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