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Old 11-15-2015, 07:46 AM   #41
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Re: Powering my outlets with inverter: Do I need Magnum MS20

Quote:
Originally Posted by daveb
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Originally Posted by DCHitt
If you have a compressor refrigerator that is a 2 way (110 ac or 12 dc) you have the perfect place to plug it into. You want it running on 12 volts or Shore power but not from the inverter. The GFI plug ahead of the battery charger (converter) is the perfect place.
In those cases where I run the main inverter (a standard SMB build) I generally throw that breaker to the fridge off so I'm not "inverting" to keep it running. On shore power it doesn't matter cause it jumps to AC power anyway. To tell the truth I don't really care anyway because I only run the big inverter for limited times. If I run it for longer times it's usually while the engine is running. For light load items I use small inverters.

Same here.....my fridge is 120V/12V....so when I turn on the inverter the fridge is using 120V. I only turn the inverter on to use the micro so it's only for a few minutes, no big deal. Even if it's for a longer time, the power from the batteries is only slightly increased when doing the unnecessary inverting.

If the fridge draws 3 amps at 12V and my inverter is 90% efficient then I'm using 3/.9=3.33 amps from the batts when on 120V. That 10% waste (that waste power is heating up the inverter) adds up over time but is no big deal for short periods of time.

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Old 11-15-2015, 09:29 AM   #42
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Re: Powering my outlets with inverter: Do I need Magnum MS20

That is all correct. Still, if you have a plug ahead of the battery charger, that is the place you should plug the refrigerator into..
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Old 11-15-2015, 12:01 PM   #43
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Re: Powering my outlets with inverter: Do I need Magnum MS20

That's true and a slight advantage veering from the normal SMB build. I mean if I were going to make huge changes in my system I'd do that but I'd also still have highest amperage shore power to the sockets for my needs. I don't think Geoff needs a high amp circuit but being SMB's standard fridge is a two way I agree that the his inverter should not be tied into socket that the fridge is plugged into. Either that or leave it unplugged. You could put it on a switch but that is something you'd need to remember to flip when necessary. I think Greg's picture would be the way to go plugged into one of the outlets prior to the inverter:



My van stays plugged into shore power at home when sitting so the fridge (when on which is quite often) is running on AC shore power & does not cycle the house battery system. With the inverter off (not inverting or charging), the inverter becomes a light amp power supply and puts out enough DC voltage to keep the ACR closed. It's one reason I have all AGM house & starting batteries.
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Old 11-15-2015, 09:25 PM   #44
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Re: Powering my outlets with inverter: Do I need Magnum MS20

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When I got my van in 2010 the breaker panel had a 30 amp main breaker feeding one 15 amp circuit breaker. That's it. The one 15 amp breaker went through the one GFI outlet and then out to the other outlets including one under the couch that the intellipower charger was plugged into. No inverter. I thought why am I even using the heavy 30 amp shore cable if all I have is one 15 amp circuit. Worse was the outlets in the van were competing for that 15 amps with the intellipower charger which can pull 900ish watts if its at full throttle. I don't know if this was a normal configuration for SMB in 2005 or the first owner wanted it. I think my build out could be more on the basic side.
This is my same setup in 2004. For some reason at the time I spent $70+ grand in all for air lockers and other 4x4 goodies, but wouldn't spend $1000 for the fancy inverter.

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being SMB's standard fridge is a two way I agree that the his inverter should not be tied into socket that the fridge is plugged into. Either that or leave it unplugged. [...]
I believe my refrigerator is 12v only. My 2004 Owners Manual from Sportsmobile says, "The 3 CF Norcold now runs on 12V only. When you plug into a 110V outlet or turn your generator on the power converter will convert some of the 110V power to 12V. This 12V power will then run your refrigerator, 12V lights, etc." -- and sure enough, when I replaced that fridge a few years ago I only remember hooking up a single 12v wire connection -- I don't remember any 110v outlet.



-- Geoff
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Old 11-15-2015, 11:43 PM   #45
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Re: Powering my outlets with inverter: Do I need Magnum MS20

That would have been your choice at the time of your build. Most choose different. No foul.
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Old 11-16-2015, 08:54 AM   #46
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Re: Powering my outlets with inverter: Do I need Magnum MS20

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For some reason at the time I spent $70+ grand in all for air lockers and other 4x4 goodies, but wouldn't spend $1000 for the fancy inverter.

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.....For some reason I had no issues cutting the roof off of my van to install a PH, but I've yet to molest any of the factory interior plastic trim........
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Old 01-21-2016, 02:01 PM   #47
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Well I finally got this work done. Here is what I ended up doing....

Mounting the Inverter: I mounted the inverter on its side under the rear seat, parallel to the charger. One bolt holds it to the rear seat metal base frame, but I didn't have room to get my drill down near the floor to make holes for any other bolts, even with the charger removed. So, instead, I used L-brackets screwed to the floor to hold the inverter in place. I put some foam on the floor to hold the inverter up off the floor, so the sharp edge of the inverter's metal case wouldn't dig into the soft wood and plastic underneath.





Inverter Input Ground Connection: My van's ground terminal block has four screw connections, of which two were populated by thin-gauge wire, so I combined those two into one -- freeing a connection for the inverter's ground (rightmost in the photo).


Inverter Input +12v Connection: Here is the 150A fuse I used for the inverter's 12v positive input. I then wired from the fuse to the "house battery" connection on the separator (left connection in photo).




Inverter Output to Outlets: The outlets on my van used to be wired into the external "shore power" via a GFCI outlet mounted externally under the rear seat. I removed this GFCI outlet, replacing it with the non-GFCI outlet that used to be mounted hidden away under the rear seat and used for the charger's input. This externally facing outlet is now powered by my new inverter, and connects to all the other outlets in the van. To power the outlet with the inverter, I connected it using a beefy power cord. I cut the female end off this power cord, and wired it into the outlet. Unfortunately, the power cord used stranded wire, which wouldn't stay put inside the outlet the way it's designed. I ended up soaking the wire strands in solder, and this made them behave like solid core -- properly seating themselves in the outlet. The male end of this power cord then plugs into the GFCI outlet of my new inverter.











Charger: The charger has a power cord that wants to be plugged into external "shore power". Rather than building an outlet box just for this purpose, I again used a power cord. I cut off the male end of this power cord, and wired it into the fuse box. Then the charger's power cord plugs into the female end of my cord so it can be powered from the fuse box.



Inverter Remote Switch: I mounted this under my sink. There was a vacant space just the right size for this remote switch!





Here is what the whole mess looks like in the end. I later wrapped all wires with corrugated split loom for protection against rubbing when the van shakes on washboard roads (not pictured).





--Geoff
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Old 01-21-2016, 02:58 PM   #48
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Geoff, glad to hear you got to your project and thank you for following up. With pictures too. I have one suggestion if it's ok. When I had my xantrex inverter it would low voltage cut out at 11.6 volts. I don't know if yours is similar. If you find that your LVC is an issue when inverting a lot of watts I would recommend putting a lug on the ground wire and bolting under that battery cable instead of the chassis block. I try to never use the chassis as a ground as it's an unknown quality and especially when your pulling 60-70 amps from the battery anywhere you can reduce voltage loss is a good thing.

Thanks again for the followup. Happy inverting.

-Eric
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