Transit 2020 AWD EcoBoost parasitic current

[Scalf77]

All those things could create problems, even change the resistance some, but not likely to give me those results

Mounting causing board flex, I am sure this board has spent a great deal of time going through extensive dynamics testing. I would suspect that they even use HALT (temp and vibration) in their design process. There could be a crack, but it would be manufacturing flaw.

These connectors are rock solid, I have inspected and cleaned. I went down a path of thinking water was causing an issue with one connector specifically.

A wire harness issue would also be a possible issue, highly unlike that it would show up as just this resistance issue.

The 42 ohms that I am reading in some ways defines possible issues. The termination for the circuit is suppose to be 120 in the PCM and 120 at the communication module. If we read the two 120 ohm resister in parallel we should get 60 ohms. (Bus should be between 54 to 66 ohm). If you were to add a second module with 120 ohm termination resister, with parallel resistance you would come in around 40 ohms. This is where MG's idea of finding the module and pulling off the resister comes from. I have been discussing issue with MG offline, initial thought was that an additional module was terminated on the bus.

Being that the PCM being isolated shows that the 60 ohm value is coming from it. Not really sure how it is laid out, but it is possible they use a split termination scheme ( 60 to 60 ohm in series with a cap to gnd in the middle). One could surmise that one of the resisters is shorted as a possibility.


-greg.

[REF]

Along those same lines, we purchased a Jeep 4xe and while we haven’t had any problems, many have reported electrical related issues on the forums that shuts the vehicle down and lights up the dash, seems to stem from the wiring harness and faulty or bent pin connections during assembly

[mgmetalworks]

Originally Posted by REF

...seems to stem from the wiring harness and faulty or bent pin connections during assembly

Ah yes... the faulty or bent pin hypothesis.

I finally resolved an intermittent error code in the Allison trans in the Cummins van that seems to have been caused by poorly connected TCM terminals. I probed all of the female terminals in the connector and found that five (out of 85) pins were loose or very loose fitting (barely making a connection) with the mating terminal. two of the five pins happened to be related to a sensor that would fault and throw the code.

So yes...faulty or bent pins can cause problems. I haven't had the error since the connector repair.

[Scalf77]

All possibilities, I don't want to think of the hours of my life lost to hunting down bent pins in sockets. backplanes cables you name it. This goes from mainframes to servers, I've probably installed more processors and memory in a motherboard in one day, than most people will do in a lifetime. Ok maybe slightly exaggerated, in a couple of days.

I did give all the cable connection a good lookover, if my eyes were twenty years younger I'd feel more confident.

-greg

[Scalf77]

The van is back from Northside Ford (NE Portland), after a couple of days the problem has not shown up. They did not address the HS1-Can termination value, but they did replace the body control module. The service manager did say they assumed because the bad module was on the bus, it was probably causing it. I did verify that the termination value is still wrong. But changing the BCM appears to have fixed the issue, which completely makes sense, it is the module that turns on the lights. It also looks like my path down HS1-CAN termination was not the issue. Leave it to an engineer to dream up a more complex failure mode than just a bad module. In my defense this was aided by the lack of two technicians not finding a bad module.

In some ways I might have got lucky, I dropped the van off on a Friday morning at 9:00. The service manager informed me that I shouldn’t have used the online appointment form, as it was primarily for routine service. This would mean that my van wouldn’t get, looked at until the following week. Other than working on the interior, I have no big plans for the van. I am a little concerned about leaving it do to location, but their hours and fencing lead me to do so.

On Saturday I receive a message on my FordPass™Connect App that the vehicle has entered deep sleep mode to conserve battery energy. This is only 28 hours from dropping off with two new AGM fully charged batteries. I had the battery disconnected while waiting for the appointment. A sure sign that the lights have come on and are draining the battery. I don’t receive any information from Northside all week and call them on Friday, a week after dropping off. The message I receive is that they have started to look at it but no information, should be more information next week. Monday afternoon, I get a call, that the BCM Body Control Module is bad, they are replacing so I need to bring in the secondary Keys for programing. I drop the keys off on Tuesday morning and I am informed by Wednesday it ready for pick up. Now it is Saturday morning, and I haven’t had the lights come on. Looks like they have fixed the issue.


From technician’s report:
Vehicle battery found to be discharged and will not jump start. Removed driver seat to access batteries. Found vehicle equipped with dual AGM replacement batteries. Removed batteries and tested with Midtronics Rotunda Battery Tester. Both batteries failed with DTC codes 304QF1940Q0C and 304QBLD46S0C. Replaced Batteries. Ran Oasis and found Batteries and Concern have been ongoing issue that two other dealers attempted to repair. Verified Headlights Randomly came on with keys out when running OASIS report. KOEO Self-Test Found multiple DTC’s. Due to batteries being drained performed battery draw test. Draw found to fluctuate between 1.011 amps and 0.064 amps randomly. When headlights come on draw exceeds 10 amps. Wiring Schematics show headlights controlled by BCM. Draw found to drop to .017 when C2280A is wiggled. Disconnected C2280A and inspected for corrosion or moisture, none present. Performed Pin Drag test, no fitment problems found. Fully seated connector and performed draw test again. Concern still present. Recommend replacing the BCM then testing for proper operation. Removed and replaced BCM using PMI procedure through FDRS. Programmed Keys and TPMS Sensors. Performed draw test. Draw found to be 0.006 Amps at rest, well within specifications. Wiggled C2280A and Verified Draw does not change. Headlight no longer randomly coming on. Installed seat and cleared DTC’s. Customer’s concern caused by faulty Body Control Module.

A couple of things to note, I was somewhat lucky that they waited a few days, and the van failed and drained the batteries. Obviously, the fact that the batteries were less than a month old probably helped. I was considerably lucky for the failure to occur at the shop. The fact that he saw the lights come on with the new batteries he just put in, while he was checking OASIS report, pretty much eliminated the train of thought from the last two dealers. The lights were not coming on because the voltage of the BCM was too low, instead it was now obvious that the lights coming on were drawing down the voltage.

Obviously, this tech was more persistent, and didn’t throw up his hands claiming it was a problem coming from the back of the van. No aftermarket things were connected to the Ford product. I will still need to go down the path of getting the HS1-CAN termination corrected. I assume this will be hard because I won’t have a failure to connect it to. You can’t start down the diagnostic flow chart if you don’t have a failure. And some crazy old customer saying so doesn’t count, at least not for warranty work.

-greg

[86Scotty]

Great news Greg! I hope it's fixed for good.

[posplayr]

EDIT, I see you resolved the issue. Congratulations. You can ignore the rest of my diatribe.
============

This seems to be a pretty long-term thread and given that there is no scope data available, it is all just guessing at this point. I don't know whether the same thing I experienced is occurring here, but the only way to diagnose it was to use a digital storage scope. Something that would automatically trigger and hold the display.

An analog scope would not work nearly as well as the aberrations do not seem to be very periodic although they are regular or perhaps better explained to be persistent.

The video basically explains how two different inverters are shorting at the DC battery input and pulling the battery voltage down indicating large current pulls as well.

This is happening in such a manner that the inverters detect their own shorting and start beeping. The Yellow inverter works like a champ and you can see multiple back t o back tests using the PSW Gidial and the yellow MSW.

There may be something damaged in the vehicle's electrical system but I would not think that it should be normal. The actual draw is so pronounced it is out of the realm of normal but the good news is you should be able to isolate it fairly easy by a process of elimination. Good luck



300W and 600W Giandel Inverter tests: BOTH have SHORTED FETs (Part 1)
https://youtu.be/kC1J5674bSw

300W and 600W Giandel Inverter tests: BOTH have SHORTED FETs (Part 2)
https://youtu.be/AtPKYKkOe6o

[marret]

Glad progress has been made Greg, hope it is fixed as well.

[Twoxentrix]

You certainly did get lucky the dealer had possession when the gremlins appeared, my dealer visits amounted to 6 separate replies over the course of several months which all ended with the infamous shoulder shrug & hands in the air...until one guy accidently discovered the issue. Sure is nice to put that behind you!

[Scalf77]

Originally Posted by Twoxentrix

You certainly did get lucky the dealer had possession when the gremlins appeared, my dealer visits amounted to 6 separate replies over the course of several months which all ended with the infamous shoulder shrug & hands in the air...until one guy accidently discovered the issue. Sure is nice to put that behind you!

You are certainly right about that. The part that makes me mad about this whole thing was the preconceived notion that the BCM was turning on the headlights because it was seeing low voltage. I am sure Ford has a history with that, and that caused them to jump to that conclusion. The fact that I told them and showed them voltage levels were fine when the lights came on. I mean it failed when I had it on the charger. Voltage level really had no impact, in fact it might have been more prevalent when I had it on the charger.

I think by knowing that was the case, it allowed him to target the BCM as the actual cause, rather than downstream victim. I also believe they are more constrained when doing warranty work.

I am still pretty convinced it was happening on a message via the can bus, because of the cyclic pattern it would get in. Obviously it just didn't have anything to do with the out of sped termination.

I am just happy to have this behind me, as I pretty much had the build out on hold.

-greg