Whitey Ford

[Nomadcat]

I was going to try to lay out my floor pieces today - insulation and plywood - and take advantage of a rare Sunday off for me.

Since I am having to work outside on the city streets, though, the rain made my decision. The dog and I sat in the van for half an hour before calling it quits.

I cannot wait until my friend in Brooklyn - the one with the garage - gets back in a week.

That's my build update for the day.

They should be coming more frequently now as I hope to be on the road in less than a month with at least a version 1.0 - no, check that - a beta version of the beast.

Over and out,

Paul

[jage]

So when you were hanging out in the van, did it seem warmer/quieter? That's really the true test as once you put in the plywood and everything else, whatever the fancy paint did will be relative.

1.1/2 ply ought to be plenty (having never built a van). I'd be thinking about where I could get away with 1/4, not about 3/4"...

2. Can you do 1/4" ply with holes for the bolts and then 1/4" ply for the second layer? Or 1/2 and 1/4, or 1/4 and 1/2... or whatever and laminate flooring.

3. NO. Among other things if it breaks down... I would think moisture etc would be a problem too.

I don't have anything for 4 and 5.

[Nomadcat]

Originally Posted by jage

So when you were hanging out in the van, did it seem warmer/quieter? That's really the true test as once you put in the plywood and everything else, whatever the fancy paint did will be relative.

1.1/2 ply ought to be plenty (having never built a van). I'd be thinking about where I could get away with 1/4, not about 3/4"...

2. Can you do 1/4" ply with holes for the bolts and then 1/4" ply for the second layer? Or 1/2 and 1/4, or 1/4 and 1/2... or whatever and laminate flooring.

3. NO. Among other things if it breaks down... I would think moisture etc would be a problem too.

I don't have anything for 4 and 5.

Incredibly, it seemed noticeably warmer. Second skin makes no great claims for sound-deadening properties of this stuff, and my regular mat was not down, but it seemed quieter. Certainly, the SPL tiles quieted it down. I could notice the difference with every ten or so that I stuck on in rest stops from Oregon to New York.

I already bought the the 1/2 inch ply for the floor. I am going to try using the jute to level the bolts - they are pretty high. If that doesn't work, I have a 2 inch hole saw and will just do the Doctor Destructo thing and cut around them. I already bought the foam core and, since I'm a big follower of the Hal The Van thread, I was prepared to use it, but I may need to ask WV Van what he thinks. Hell, I know what he thinks, he's using it. You really think it'll collect water? Ugh.

I'm not worried about it breaking down as I think the weight will be pretty evenly distributed.

It does bring up the issue, though, of the floor area. My plans have been to floor the whole van. As I have also thought, though, and as I have seen somebody else here once write, flooring just the visible floor and leaving the cabinet areas is not a bad way to go, either, in terms of getting access later.

Problem is, my layout is not certain yet and may not be until after this first trip, so I may just do the whole thing and try to limit the screws I use. Worse comes to worse, it'll just give me another project down the road, ripping up the deck and doing it again. I'm hoping it doesn't come to that, though.

Rain the next two or three days. I am itching to do. Maybe, if I can post live updates via my iPhone through that Tapatalk, I'll give updates as I do it, hopefully on Wednesday and definitely by Thursday. Otherwise, each night.

I'm going to try to bang this out, then move on to the overhead and bulkheads week after this. If I can then get the main platform and some upper cabinets done the following week, I can take a trip, figure it out on the road, and do minimal tear-down when I get back before a more permanent build.

[Nomadcat]

The weather was spectacular and I got the day off from work, as planned.

The only glitch, which I chose to ignore, is that I found out from the Second Skin guys that their "Firewall" thermal paint can take 30 days to cure. I laid the floor anyway. I cannot wait. What does this mean for me? In all likelihood, nothing. After a few 100 degree days down the road, I don't think I'll have anything to worry about. The paint was plenty dry. Even it it puts off some vapor in the next two weeks, I am not worried. Anyway, what's done is done.

The only other note: my point and shoot was accidentally set to ISO 1250 or 1600 today, so the shots are all super grainy.

So first, my workshop of the day was next to the Williamsburg Bridge, on the Manhattan side. Beggars cannot be choosey, and I needed to make a lot of noise cutting (how did I live so long without a Milwaukee jigsaw? I have used mainly handsaws to this point in my life). This area has its share of really old Puerto Rican and Dominican guys with ancient custom vans, and one of them would drive by occasionally and give me the thumbs up.

Anyway, I am hoping for a real workshop space - with a table saw - for the floors and walls. That should happen early next week. Here's where I worked today, though:


I first laid down the foil/jute combo. This did not take too long. Used a tin snips to cut it to shape. I am also still undecided on the stock jack/lug wrench location. I probably could panel behind it with minimal insulation, but I'm going to have to think hard about that. I already have a much heavier duty jack, but the stock lug wrench is the only one I have that fits on the long bolts on the aluminess carrier. Anyway, I'll figure that one out down the road.


THEN, I put down something I got at the lumber yard - it's made by DOW and allegedly has an R rating of 3.3, It's foil on both sides and some brittle foam stuff in the middle. I used aluminum tape on the seams and the dents I made in it and put it right on top of the jute/foil. This stuff is 1/2" thick:

[Nomadcat]

Then came the baltic birch. I used my factory mat, by the way, to outline the foamcore and it worked pretty well, so I laid down the two 5x5 pieces of baltic birch - 1/2" - and laid the mat on top. If I made the passenger side flush with one side of the 5x10 rectangle of wood, there was really just a 2" or less gap on the driver side, along with a couple of small gaps in the rear corners. I decided to go this route, essentially creating the floor from two pieces of wood. It came out better than the photo looks, and I'll get some better shots before I lay down the final flooring, whether it be rubber industrial tiles or this great material I have used that is made for walking on with skates in hockey rinks. It's indestructible. Anyway, here's the floor before I lined up the seams:


I probably could have gotten away with a floating floor - even with the small side pieces it was pretty tight. The hardest thing was getting it into place without ripping up the foil/foam or my back muscles. I finally laid in the back and was able to get much better control by using my feet to raise each piece and angle it in correctly. The rear piece needed a little fine trimming while in place.

So, I essentially have a two piece floor, along with a few side pieces. I need to maybe re-cut two of them to make for a better fit, but the big two are in place. As I said, it was pretty tight on its own, but I wanted it secure. Also, because of the double layers below, I wanted some downward pressure, so I put about 6 screws into each piece. I used a couple of 2" screws for places where I was screwing into a valley on the floor, but was able to get away with 1 1/2" screws for most of it, with about a quarter coming through the bottom. So, after a bit of compression, my floor sandwich is about an inch and a quarter thick. Not so bad.

I went underneath and put a gob of permagasket on all but one of the screws coming through the bottom. One of them was just not visible, but I got the rest. I may zip a few more in, but it's remarkably solid so far. I imagine that it'll just get more solid once I get some stuff built on top of it. Also, the edges, even though I cut some wood and filled them in, don't bother me because they will most likely be built over.

Finally, on the driver's side, I wedged some 2x3 in between the floor and the bottom of that sheet metal lip. Not sure if I'll leave it there and build up the walls from that or not.

I'm going to cheat the rear walls for the last 48 inches so as to keep as much of the width as possible. If I can get away with a bed that goes from side to side, it would be so great. I'm 5'9" and might get away with it, but it's awful close on the floor and I think it gets tighter up top. Anyway, I'm flexible. This was a big one.

I think I'm going to do the ceiling next and the walls last. I'm now leaning towards 1/4" oak ply, but need to do a few more tests.

Over and out.

Paul

[Nomadcat]

Got two ceiling panels up yesterday. Took longer than I'd thought for a couple of reasons. The first, as usual, being my street working situation and this time I had to unload more stuff than usual before I could start to work. My workshop yesterday was in the now-fashionable Meat Market, known to tourists as the "Meatpacking District," but known to us for decades as the Meat Market where, until ten years ago, the streets emptied after 4pm and were kind of spooky at night, with hustlers and crackheads, until the meatpacking guys came to work at 2am.

Anyway, I had to kludge the front rib because I am keeping the factory headliner for now, although I did insulate under the headliner. This left only the front of the forward-most metal rib, so I had to affix some 3/4" square pine to the front of it. Not the most sturdy, although it will more than do for the job. I discovered a few useful things, though, in this endeavor:

1. Never use pine for struts or ribs. It cracks too easily. Even though I use it all the time in regular woodworking, and it's possible I got a particularly crack-prone batch, I think that there is just not as much give when you're screwing it into metal. BY FAR, the better choice is poplar. I used 1/2" by 2" poplar for the other ribs and it was perfect.

2. Use 1/2 wood for ribs if you want to bend it. 3/4", even 3/4" square, just doesn't bend in a friendly way.

Here's a photo of the front support. Not pretty, but it worked, especially after I had shaped it a bit, after taking this photo:


I then put on the poplar rib behind it and tested the fit. Looked pretty nice and flush with the factory headliner. My only regret with this phase is that I had the guys at the lumber yard cut the wood and was not able to match the grain of the pieces to each other. No big deal, but I would have done it differently had I a table saw. If my friend can't come through with the workshop this week, I am going to freestyle the walls panels with the jigsaw.

Anyway, I then used adhesive and put two layers of the foil-backed jute on the ceiling. There is also a 1/4" space between the wood and the foil, which may or may not help the radiant qualities of the foil. I then put some holes in the panel and gently screwed it into place, this time using round-head screws. I wanted to be able to remove them easily and this lets me do that. I don't mind the slight industrial look and, if I ever want to replace or change panels, I can just use the old ones, along with the screw holes, as templates. I drilled into the metal ribs and put the first one in place.


The photo above shows the first panel in place, along with the insulation and the second poplar rib already up for the second panel. After the second panel, it looked like this:


I hope to finish the overhead this week and start on the walls. I could come straight down the the walls, but I am loathe to lose so much space. So, at the expense of smooth lines and less work, I may do a piece around the top, maybe 8 inches or so, that cuts from the ceiling to the wall at an angle, then do the main wall pieces straight down, for a slightly vaulted effect. I like the 1/4" birch and think it'll look good when I have finished it with Tung oil.

This being New York City, of course, and since I had laid all of my materials at the back of the van under the pleasant little tree by the highway, I discovered that a pigeon had shat on my fourth panel while I was working. Perhaps my old Greek grandmother would have said "that's good luck, Paul," but that's not what I thought as I was wiping it down.

Anyway, I wish I could go work on it today, but I have my real work to do.

Off to work.

Ugh.

Paul

[blkjak]

looks good paul!
good heads up on the poplar; will be doing my celing the same way.
blkjak

[Nomadcat]

Thanks. I'm actually going to use that thin poplar for the side ribs, as well, but 1/2" by 3" instead of by 2".

You could put screws right into the sheet metal on the sides, but I like wooden ribs.

[jage]

When you say "straight down the sides", you don't mean vertical do you? It looks like from right under the trim to the outside edge of the floor would give you a fairly straight wall, albeit at an angle.

Looks good. Can't wait to see more.

[Nomadcat]

Well, vertical from top to bottom, or bottom to top, as it were, but not straight. I want to curve it to the walls and pick up that extra inch or so. Much as I'd like to sleep from wall to wall, I think I'm going to lost the space I need once I put in any walls and will have to re-figure my bed arrangement/platform.

I have been watching WV Van's bed plans and actuating lever work with awe. Mine will be a simpler setup.