Engine Controllers

[carringb]

If you are a conservative driver, advancing the timing can reduce some of the soot problems (which otherwise you avoid by driving the snot out of it). Under your normal driving, I suspect you'll be fine but when you have an inevitable injector failure, I would be concerned that the tune could accelerate the damage. Sometimes pulling over and calling for a tow to prevent damage just isn't feasible.

[EMrider]

. Thanks Rob, but just as Jim describes, from what I have read, most folks seem to be looking for more power or more speed. We are looking for neither of those. They rarely seem to be looking only for fuel economy.

Greg, the search for more power certainly seems to be a common denominator in subsequent problems.

Sometimes it appears that the tune owners expect is not what they actually get, and that tunes error on the side of "more" when it comes to power.

Good luck with your decision.

Rob

[Tapatio]

Originally Posted by carringb

I'm on my phone so I can't really get into the how's and why a tuner can be harmful. If you are not making black smoke, the only way to further improve efficiency is to advance injector timing, which increases cylinder pressure and combustion temps. Neither of those things will help the longevity of your motor. But if saving a couple bucks per trip is worth more frequent motor replacements, go for it I guess.

When a 6.0 grenades it ain't pretty

Disclaimer: carringb is way more knowledgeable than I am. The following is based on internet gossip and intuition. Trust him, not me.

That being said here's how I justified my tune.

The E series 6.0 produces 90hp less than the F series (235hp vs 325hp), fact. Internet gossip says this is due to more restrictive headers and potential over heating issues. Both engines are mechanically and electronically the same, just tuned differently, I don't know for sure but it sounds plausible.

Before my tune the van ran like crap. Felt like someone had stuck a banana in the tailpipe. The tranny shifted at the wrong time and shifts were mushy. It was drivable but just didn't feel right. I met a trusted forum member who recommended SCT Tuners Economy tune (+40hp). The economy tune transformed the drivetrain and now the van drives what I would consider to be normal.

My reasoning is that a +40hp map on a -90hp engine shouldn't melt pistons right?

Increased gas mileage, meh. The best way to increase fuel mileage is to drive slower. That's a difficult thing to do and I just can't drive 55.

So far I've put 20k miles with no issues but I do save a few dollars each month for a new crate engine because you never know.

[REF]

Different horse, I've got a 7.3 and wasn't really going for increased MPG's, but the edge did nothing for me, in fact it went haywire and I yanked it. Went with DP tuner, better power, tunes made for the E series and I do see an increase in MPG's. Keep in mind, as mentioned, that the tuning is a bit different between the vans and the trucks and those out of the box tuners like edge are tuned for these engines in the F series, unless they specify, and will most likely not be the best thing to run on the vans. I would go with one of the ones mentioned here, like SCT, or at least look into them before you install an edge, I think you'll get better results with your intended purpose of increased MPG, and more power never hurts!

[Greg In Austin]

Thanks for all of the input....

I remain on a search for someone who has actually installed and used an EDGE product on an E-series 6.0L Powerstroke.

[daveb]

I'm on the fence with tuning up the engine. If I can have a selectable custom tune or any engine upgrade that can keep turbo and oil temps down, provides better transmission operation and overall helps protect the engine I'm all for it even if I loose MPG's. I care less about gaining MPG's if it can potentially harm the engine. But I have been told that controlling the EGR can help yet I really don't know. In Ca you have to pass smog every couple of years and can't do an EGR block... I mean is smog control a good thing or not? I'm no mechanic, so I'm going with what the guys working on my van suggest. I just hope they're right.

[E350]

Greg: I assume you would go with Edge Juice with Attitude 2003-2007 (6.0L engine range in F series, while 6.0L engine range in E series was 2003-2009).

http://edgeproducts.com/products/03-07- ... -cs-11001/

So, as I am sure you already know, Edge does not list a product for a 6.0L in a 2008 van.

I ran a "Edge Juice" search in the 6.0L subforum at Ford-Trucks.com and came up with a couple threads (I did not search for posts).

http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/13241 ... stion.html

http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/13236 ... rsion.html

http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/12972 ... stion.html

You may want to read Texans posts in the following thread and even pm him:

http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/10754 ... ngine.html

See generally:

http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/forum107/

IMHO, your desires for what you want it to do are independent of what it will in fact do. So you need measurements of what it is doing. And the one thing you should measure is exhaust gas temperatures in each exhaust manifold.

So, talk to Edge.

And because talk is cheap, install an EGT sensor in each manifold (dual EGT temperature sensors) and let us know what temps you monitor heading into the Texas hill county towing on some of those hot Texas days.

You are no doubt deeper into the research than what I posted above. I posted it to help deepen the knowledge pool of this thread for other readers.

[Greg In Austin]

E350,

No, I am actually looking at the Evolution because I have talked to someone who had one in their E series of the same vintage. The Juice and the similar product both really look like they are trying to drive power.

Remember that in 2008 the e-series as delayed because Ford was trying to change engines along with the F-series and although they did change sheet metal for the E, they stayed with the 2007 6.0L Diesel instead of moving with the F series to a new motor. So I am really looking at the 2007 F series Evolution.

The person I am trying to find really only installed the Edge Evolution to gain some monitoring capabilities, and the fuel economy improvement was completely incidental. If I can get the same incidental MPG improvement... great... if not, it is easy to remove.

I have two almost identical mulit-100s of miles trips coming up and am thinking about this as a testing opportunity.

[E350]

10-4.
Return to post your experience, good or bad.

[E350]

For an absolutely hilarious video of windowed engine blocks caused by advanced timing in the 7.3L world, see below:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... o79GObMLE4

Joe (aka "CSIPSD") has, IIRC, windowed at least three 7.3L engine blocks, I believe primarily due to his own home brewed tuning/mods, etc.. He was a god on Ford Truck Enthusiasts ("FTE" i.e., ford-trucks.com). And God bless him for trying stuff so we don't have to. Unfortunately, he was banned from the FTE 7.3L forum because of his rants against a particular tuning company which is a sponsor of the 7.3L forum. However, Joe was always helpful to me and to others, if a little blunt.

Finally, based on my reading, tuning without gauges and other supporting mods is asking to learn by blind trial and error. With copious reading in the applicable ford-trucks.com diesel engine forum, you may have the chance to learn from the errors of others. And then, of course, there are the few posters there who actually know what they are talking about. Read for a month and you will recongnize them.

Good Luck!

and Free CSIPSD!