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Old 02-06-2011, 02:54 PM   #51
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Re: How much does your van weigh?

I don't know where paying higher reg. fees suspends the laws of physics. Not in CA. A trip down MX-1 to see all the crosses, most from overloaded rigs and a lack of regs, would be instructive here.

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Originally Posted by Ford_6L_E350
You can swap out the rear axle for a Dana 70 fairly cheaply. I got one off an E350 Cutaway SRW for $1500. That axle is a full floater rated for 7800#. I thought it was reasonable insurance.

Mike
Chevy only rates that axle for 6,084# (came standard on my G3500). Maybe a difference in philosophy and/or conservatism vis a vis Ford? Comparable brakes, etc, but almost a ton higher rating (one axle) but the Chevy has a higher GCWR, I think? I've never heard of a frame failure due to high weight, only axle failures, so this is peculiar, maybe pushing the envelope a bit on the part of Ford.
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Old 02-06-2011, 03:05 PM   #52
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Re: How much does your van weigh?

Quote:
Originally Posted by webbmac
Chevy only rates that axle for 6,084# (came standard on my G3500). Maybe a difference in philosophy and/or conservatism vis a vis Ford? Comparable brakes, etc, but almost a ton higher rating (one axle) but the Chevy has a higher GCWR, I think? I've never heard of a frame failure due to high weight, only axle failures, so this is peculiar, maybe pushing the envelope a bit on the part of Ford.
The standard D60 Semi Floater in a Ford van is rated at 6340#, yet the van is rated at 6,084# for the rear axle. Why? The tires are the limiting factor. LT245/75-16Es are rated at 3042# each. Probably the same tires as your Chevy van, hence the same ratings.

The D70 Full Floater in a Ford E350 cutaway is rated at 7800# and again the tires reduce the rating of the axle.

Mike
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Old 02-06-2011, 03:47 PM   #53
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Re: How much does your van weigh?

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Originally Posted by Ford_6L_E350

The standard D60 Semi Floater in a Ford van is rated at 6340#, yet the van is rated at 6,084# for the rear axle. Why? The tires are the limiting factor. LT245/75-18Es are rated at 3042# each. Probably the same tires as your Chevy van, hence the same ratings.

The D70 Full Floater in a Ford E350 cutaway is rated at 7800# and again the tires reduce the rating of the axle.

Mike
Gotcha Mike, thanks for the explanation. That's good to know, made me breathe a sigh of relief. I didn't know if something was wrong with my D70HD full floater. It seems like a matter of semantics, though, and it would/should be fairly easy to standardize the ratings.
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Old 02-06-2011, 04:17 PM   #54
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Re: How much does your van weigh?

I edited my post to correct the wheel size from 18" to 16"

My bad.

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Old 02-06-2011, 07:47 PM   #55
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Re: How much does your van weigh?

Quote:
Originally Posted by webbmac
I don't know where paying higher reg. fees suspends the laws of physics.
I doesn't. It allows you to meet the letter of the law. Driver's are still responsible for operating their vehicles in a safe manner for the load being transported.

BTW - the E350 van has the exact same brakes as the 12,500 cutaway.


On the Dana 70 topic.... Many extended Ford vans got the Dana 70 full floater from the factory. But its hit and miss. Certainly not all of them. It is also not quite the same as the D70 in the Express van. That axle is rated for 7500 pounds, instead of 7800. The hub is smaller on the chevy version, so I think it has smaller bearings. The newest Chevy 3500 vans have a semi-float axle.
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Old 02-06-2011, 07:53 PM   #56
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Re: How much does your van weigh?

Quote:

Chevy only rates that axle for 6,084# (came standard on my G3500). Maybe a difference in philosophy and/or conservatism vis a vis Ford? Comparable brakes, etc, but almost a ton higher rating (one axle) but the Chevy has a higher GCWR, I think? I've never heard of a frame failure due to high weight, only axle failures, so this is peculiar, maybe pushing the envelope a bit on the part of Ford.

The Fords have a larger frame than the Chevy van. And not by a small margin. The Ford vans also have a higher max GCWR (20,000 pounds vs 16,0000 pounds for the Chevy or 17,000 for the new Duramax vans). Brakes on the Ford are also larger.
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Old 02-06-2011, 10:05 PM   #57
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Re: How much does your van weigh?

Quote:
Originally Posted by carringb

The Fords have a larger frame than the Chevy van. And not by a small margin. The Ford vans also have a higher max GCWR (20,000 pounds vs 16,0000 pounds for the Chevy or 17,000 for the new Duramax vans). Brakes on the Ford are also larger.
Actually, it is the exact opposite. The E-350 has a 13" front disc, and a marginally smaller rear disc. The Chevy has close to a 14" brake all around, and much thicker than the Ford.

Both vans weigh the same but the Chevy only has a single wall body. That weight has to go somewhere and it can only go lower in the frame or drivetrain.

The Ford may be 'rated' significantly higher GCWR for towing than the Chevy even with smaller brakes and the EB's goofy rear overhang, plus the inferior trans. and rear end. All that says is the ratings can be manipulated.
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Old 02-06-2011, 11:48 PM   #58
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Re: How much does your van weigh?

Quote:
Originally Posted by webbmac
Quote:
Originally Posted by carringb

The Fords have a larger frame than the Chevy van. And not by a small margin. The Ford vans also have a higher max GCWR (20,000 pounds vs 16,0000 pounds for the Chevy or 17,000 for the new Duramax vans). Brakes on the Ford are also larger.
Actually, it is the exact opposite. The E-350 has a 13" front disc, and a marginally smaller rear disc. The Chevy has close to a 14" brake all around, and much thicker than the Ford.

Both vans weigh the same but the Chevy only has a single wall body. That weight has to go somewhere and it can only go lower in the frame or drivetrain.

The Ford may be 'rated' significantly higher GCWR for towing than the Chevy even with smaller brakes and the EB's goofy rear overhang, plus the inferior trans. and rear end. All that says is the ratings can be manipulated.
Your information is incorrect. The Chevy Express has 12.78" front rotors and 12.99" rear rotors. At least through 2010. For 2011 is is 12.8" front, 13.0" rear. The Ford E-series has 13.58" rotors all around. Besides that, the E350 has 270 sq. in swept area front, and 299 rear vs 245"sq front, 237 rear for the 2011 Express. I have towed extensively with both vans, and the Express van (pre-2011) has dangerously long stopping distances when towing a trailer without trailer brakes. I have not used a 2011.

And what makes the TorqueShift 5-speed an inferior transmission? It's used in applications up to 33,000 pounds, and in the E-series up to 22,000.
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Old 02-07-2011, 06:31 AM   #59
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Re: How much does your van weigh?

This is like the Steelers versus the Packers but without any good commercials.
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Old 02-08-2011, 02:17 PM   #60
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Re: How much does your van weigh?

Sorry, I got a little grumpy. Fords are great. Love my chevy, too (I'm a Ford guy, BTW, owned 2 econolines, multiple f series and a couple of Broncos). What I really like on the Chevy as it relates to towing is the longer wheelbase and hitch receiver being closer to the rear axle. Good luck with tight turns, though.

Carringb, you are correct, the web site I saw had transposed the brake #s (could not have been me ).

Regarding the Torqueshift, that is an excellent transmission, very heavy duty, my comment was only in the context of towing where the Chevy (at least the Dmax) has the push button tow mode and grade brake.

Cheers!
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