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Chance 02-09-2014 11:05 AM

Transit updates from SMB?
 
1 Attachment(s)
Information on new USA Transit is starting to come out in advance of Ford starting to take orders. Of interest to me were pricing, preliminary engine ratings, and available options/packages, including RV prep package. Not a lot of details yet on packages like heavy duty towing.

Has anyone seen or heard reports or updates from SMB on Transit? Seems they came out with data on ProMaster well in advance of actual availability, although my recollection on timing may be off.


BTW, preliminary engine ratings for those who can't view pictures are:

Std V6 - 266 HP and 249 lb-ft

Eco-Boost - 320 HP and 400 lb-ft

3.2L Diesel - 190 HP and 346 lb-ft

Early specs subject to change seem to show std V6 will have 3.73 on low and medium roofs, and 4.10 on high roof. Also 4.10 will be optional on low and medium roof vans. Diesel and Eco-Boost will have 3.31 std and 3.73 as option.

BroncoHauler 02-09-2014 11:20 AM

Re: Transit updates from SMB?
 
Anyone know if the EcoBoosts have gotten any closer to their claimed MPG figures? On other forums I've seen a lot of discussion that owners (F150's) weren't even getting close to the MPG claims. There don't seem to be any complaints about the power though, which may explain the lower than expected MPG numbers.


Herb

Chance 02-09-2014 02:13 PM

Re: Transit updates from SMB?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BroncoHauler
Anyone know if the EcoBoosts have gotten any closer to their claimed MPG figures? On other forums I've seen a lot of discussion that owners (F150's) weren't even getting close to the MPG claims. There don't seem to be any complaints about the power though, which may explain the lower than expected MPG numbers.


Herb

Exactly right. As far as I know, EPA test has a predetermined schedule of speed and acceleration. Since the base 3.7L V6 can accelerate fast enough to complete the test, it's doubtful the EcoBoost needs much boost, if any at all, to produce the needed power. Hence good EPA rating almost as good as base engine.

On the street drivers with more power will use more of it. Hence more fuel. Maybe that's why Ford developed a smaller 2.7L V6 Eco-Boost for the new F-150. I'd guess that will eventually filter down to Transit.

carringb 02-09-2014 03:11 PM

Re: Transit updates from SMB?
 
I have friends with EcoBoost pickups. If you drive them like any other pickup, they easily get the stated fuel economy. However, its so smooth, quiet, and powerful most Eco drivers hot rod them around, which is why most get worse than the rating. The quietness of that motor combined with its power is pretty amazing, but also makes it easy to drive harder than you need to. One friend lifted it and put on oversized tires, which dropped him about 3 MPG. He gained back about half of that using 5-Star's economy tune, which reduces boost under light throttle.

My mom's '13 Mercedes GLK350 is the same way. When I drive, I get about 13 MPG driving around Portland freeways, but if you set cruise control near the speed limits, it'll get 28.

EMrider 02-09-2014 08:05 PM

Re: Transit updates from SMB?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Chance
Quote:

Originally Posted by BroncoHauler
Anyone know if the EcoBoosts have gotten any closer to their claimed MPG figures? On other forums I've seen a lot of discussion that owners (F150's) weren't even getting close to the MPG claims. There don't seem to be any complaints about the power though, which may explain the lower than expected MPG numbers.


Herb

Exactly right. As far as I know, EPA test has a predetermined schedule of speed and acceleration. Since the base 3.7L V6 can accelerate fast enough to complete the test, it's doubtful the EcoBoost needs much boost, if any at all, to produce the needed power. Hence good EPA rating almost as good as base engine.

On the street drivers with more power will use more of it. Hence more fuel. Maybe that's why Ford developed a smaller 2.7L V6 Eco-Boost for the new F-150. I'd guess that will eventually filter down to Transit.

When I was considering purchasing a new pickup about 6 months ago, I did a lot of reading about the Ecoboost F-150. I decided to buy a 2005 Jeep Wrangler instead. But one concern about the Ecoboost that came up very often on forums and seemed credible was a problem with the intercooler design that can cause water condensation to be ingested into the motor. This causes a sudden loss of power and the motor to shudder and go into limp mode. Do some reading and you will find this issue mentioned very often. It seems to be a bigger deal in humid climates. I wonder if Ford has addresses this problem in newer model years. A new Transit is probably in my future and aside from this issue, the Ecoboost seems to be a winner.

Rob

UJOINT 02-09-2014 08:07 PM

Re: Transit updates from SMB?
 
I can't wait for the crew cab! I may go to the measuring session.

carringb 02-10-2014 12:19 AM

Re: Transit updates from SMB?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by EMrider
...But one concern about the Ecoboost that came up very often on forums and seemed credible was a problem with the intercooler design that can cause water condensation to be ingested into the motor. This causes a sudden loss of power and the motor to shudder and go into limp mode. Do some reading and you will find this issue mentioned very often. It seems to be a bigger deal in humid climates. I wonder if Ford has addresses this problem in newer model years. A new Transit is probably in my future and aside from this issue, the Ecoboost seems to be a winner.

Rob

They have fixed this. Most of the trucks only needed a reflash, but some of them needed the updated intercooler. My friend's truck was one of those due to his driving cycle (~5 mile commute home with a 25% grade going up to his house, which is where the condensation ingestion would happen) combined with the damp Oregon weather. The updated intercooler made the problem go away completely.

EMrider 02-10-2014 09:38 AM

Re: Transit updates from SMB?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by carringb
Quote:

Originally Posted by EMrider
...But one concern about the Ecoboost that came up very often on forums and seemed credible was a problem with the intercooler design that can cause water condensation to be ingested into the motor. This causes a sudden loss of power and the motor to shudder and go into limp mode. Do some reading and you will find this issue mentioned very often. It seems to be a bigger deal in humid climates. I wonder if Ford has addresses this problem in newer model years. A new Transit is probably in my future and aside from this issue, the Ecoboost seems to be a winner.

Rob

They have fixed this. Most of the trucks only needed a reflash, but some of them needed the updated intercooler. My friend's truck was one of those due to his driving cycle (~5 mile commute home with a 25% grade going up to his house, which is where the condensation ingestion would happen) combined with the damp Oregon weather. The updated intercooler made the problem go away completely.

Good to know, thanks.
R

Chance 02-10-2014 10:43 AM

Re: Transit updates from SMB?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by carringb
I have friends with EcoBoost pickups. If you drive them like any other pickup, they easily get the stated fuel economy. However, its so smooth, quiet, and powerful most Eco drivers hot rod them around, which is why most get worse than the rating. The quietness of that motor combined with its power is pretty amazing, but also makes it easy to drive harder than you need to. One friend lifted it and put on oversized tires, which dropped him about 3 MPG. He gained back about half of that using 5-Star's economy tune, which reduces boost under light throttle.

My mom's '13 Mercedes GLK350 is the same way. When I drive, I get about 13 MPG driving around Portland freeways, but if you set cruise control near the speed limits, it'll get 28.

If a driver plans to use the available power, in your opinion what is the advantage of the EcoBoost versus a larger naturally aspirated engine?

The 5.0L V8 in truck tune is comparable in power to the 3.5L EcoBoost V6. In an F-150 driven the same or towing a typical 5,000 pound RV trailer, would the EB save significant fuel? And will a smaller EB that is stressed higher last as long as a 5.0L V8 doing same work?

Obviously the 5.0L isn't available on Transit but I'm interested in your opinion on EB durability and cost over time due to greater complexity.

BTW, noticed on one Ford spec that on heavier duty Transit chassis cabs and cutaways the EB is not listed as an option. The configurator only shows std V6 and diesel. I'm guessing commercial/fleet buyers would likely avoid the EcoBoost V6 anyway.

carringb 02-10-2014 06:17 PM

Re: Transit updates from SMB?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Chance
If a driver plans to use the available power, in your opinion what is the advantage of the EcoBoost versus a larger naturally aspirated engine?

Turbos, which means no power loss at elevation. Other than that, none. The EcoBoost 3.5L compares better performance wise with the 6.2L, and the Eco certainly bests that. But if you stuck the EcoBoost in a large profile vehicle, like a motorhome or box truck, it would be boost all the time and would as much fuel as a large displacement motor. Compared to the 5.0, the EcoBoost is more powerful, and the biggest difference is towing when the EcoBoost can pull hills at 2,500 RPM while the 5.0 is pushing 5k.

As for longevity... I don't think it would last as long. Long enough for most users, yes. But could a 3.5L EcoBoost go 500,000 miles under severe service conditions? I doubt it. But the V10 could no problem.

I've also experienced the EcoBoost going into limp-mode after a hard climb with a trailer because the cylinder heads were getting too hot. It only took about a minute to cool down. The V10 would not have done that (I've taken the same route with the van too).


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