Car-B-Q

[TomsBeast]

Originally Posted by mikracer

I suspected the same as you but my thoughts were to disconnect the positive side of the battery.

NHRA requires you to have an exterior battery cutoff switch when trunk mounting your battery. I was thinking a battery cutoff accessible from the outside of the van might be a good idea in case something like this happens. Thoughts?

Disconnecting either cable stops separates power between the battery and the vehicle, the negative side is my go-to (especially in an emergency) because you can short the wrench between the negative post and the body, and have no effect. Short the positive side against the body with a wrench and you've made an arc welder, which is easier to do in a panic.



Related story: I almost forgot about this one; I once talked my daughters through disconnecting a battery during a small electrical fire, over cell phone, while they were on the side of the road. They were in a borrowed 1970 VW bug convertible, smoke was pouring out of the engine compartment. "hit it with the fire extinguisher, yank out the rear seat, grab a wrench and disconnect the battery, call me back after it's under control. Oh, have your sister grab as much stuff as she can out of the back seat in case it burns down, you go this now GO!" I told the oldest one. As a result of quick action, they saved the car before it got out of hand.



Yep, NHRA requires an external battery cutoff switch in cars w/relocated batteries, and all of the faster cars (I want to say 9.90 and quicker). Just about every other race organizations requires the same. Its a good tool for the safety/emergency crews. I could see that being helpful on a SMB. Those switches also go bad, and running more cables makes more failure points.

Originally Posted by daveb

the video makes me want to re-think about having a basic bug out bag that would be the first thing you grab

That's an excellent point, I have two, and carry one just behind the driver's seat on every trip, in my commuter car, I drag it with me on long trips even if we travel in someone else's car. It's becoming a habit to be the first thing I grab if there's some sort of minor emergency.



A tether for the dog is another great idea, I came a cross a rollover on Saline Valley Road last xmas. Bystanders said the couple took off running into the desert after their puppy... that could have really gone bad in several ways.

[Pritikin]

Re: the comments about taking time to setup a camera

In the video he explains the initial firefighting efforts occurred before he setup a camera. So his priorities were in the right order. Recall it appeared that the fire had died down... so, since the guys a blogger, the equipment for this is going to be 'on top' of everything else. It makes sense that once he felt he might have put the fire out that he'd setup the camera.

Of course once the fire started again there was no reason to take the time to _stop_ filming once it was setup. Thus he has footage of his next efforts -- removing stuff from the jeep and fighting the larger fire. I imagine he was pretty stressed and working hard. In those conditions taking a few minutes to rest, drink some water, and perhaps move the camera, is part of the effort.

I like the comments about having a bug-out plan.

[Element]

JWA was kind enough to bring this thread to my attention and I thought I would chime in with some observations having watched the video and read all of the posts thus far. As some of you may know I'm the guy from the Jay Leno video showing the Element fire extinguisher. For those that missed it here is a link to the Sportsmobile thread where this subject is discussed:

http://www.sportsmobileforum.com/for...her-22138.html

Now getting back to the topic at hand I would have the following observations:

- First of all bravo to the video maker for both documenting his ordeal but also for responsibly doing his best to contain the fire and try and prevent a wild brush fire. There is a lot to be learned here and his sharing the experience will surely help a lot of people in the future.

- I cannot comment on the reason for the fire but it shows itself to be your typical car fire where it starts off slow and then grows beyond the ability of anything less than a fire truck to handle.

- As discussed fitting an electrical cut off switch to an overland vehicle like this is huge and can really help stop a fire from spreading any faster than necessary. I come from the racing world and the FIRST thing you do when a race car stops is to kill the power regardless of the reason.

- Hindsight being what it is I would say that by opening the hood and THEN going to the back of the vehicle for an extinguisher that he likely accelerated the fire the most at this time. That rush of air from opening the hood really fed the flames and then the lost time of getting the extinguisher was HUGE. You should always approach a fire with your available tools in hand. I do not blame him for a second just that experience will teach this lesson and hopefully some here will benefit from this mistake in approach.

- Certainly an Element extinguisher would have helped when the cabin caught fire and in dealing with the firewall fire. A powder extinguisher needs a direct coverage of flame to put the fire out. The gas from an Element creeps into nooks and crannies near a firewall or a inside a dash to combat a fire better.

- The traditional fire bottle would have worked well if he had a direct line of sight to the flames and 'possibly' the short discharge time of the bottle affected his ability to assess the situation. This is merely a hypothesis and I do not want to be critical as it is easy to play expert after the fact

Scary situation for sure and amazing to see not only the speed of the fire but the pops and explosions along the way as the Jeep burned.

[JWA]

Thanks Rob---great observations, especially about approaching a known fire with tools in hand and a battery cut-off switch being important too.

[shenrie]

I was told never to open the hood in an instance like this for that exact reason. youd be providing the small fire a lot more oxygen and then it explodes in size from there. plus you might seriously burn your hands (does that apply with fiberglass hoods?)which would impede progress fighting the flames going forward. was told to aim fire extinguisher under vehicle towards where you think fire is and walk around each side and front going in small bursts to try and smother from all sides available. please correct me if ive been misdirected.


agree on cutoff switch (also from a car racing background) and had planned on installing one when I do all my rewiring, but now im second guessing where that switch should be after seeing this vid and hearing everyones ideas.


either way, thanks for posting the vid madscience. this has been pretty eye opening.

[MadScience]

You'd likely need two battery cutouts.

One for the starter battery, and one for the house battery/batteries. Diesels with a second starter battery located on the frame rail would probably need a third.

All of these are additional failure points. Take a look at the various shunt and sprinter fuse issues folks have run into.

So, I'm not sure I'd go that way. Perhaps having the right tool to pull the grounds off quickly (my house battery is nicely accessible) near the extinguisher is the right compromise.

So far I've ordered some quick release clamps for a 5lbs extinguisher and a shovel to put on the outside somewhere.

I still wonder if just shoveling sand on the fire itself, even in the interior would have helped. I agree that the element seems like it would have worked well there, if it was sufficient in quantity.

[Element]

On the subject of battery cut outs here is a tip from the racing world that can save you a little bit of money.

Many European cars like BMW's and Audi's are shipped with a high quality Hella brand electrical cut off switch wired to thick OEM quality wires as part of a transportation harness that is removed and discarded when the cars arrive at the dealership. Yes that is right, these really nice harnesses are literally thrown away by the dealership!

Racers caught on to this years ago so if you go to a BMW or Audi dealership and ask them for some of these harnesses they will normally be happy to give them to you. With it not only will you save a lot of money but also most of the work will be done for you making it easy to wire an OEM quality harness to your Sportsmobile.

[JWA]

Originally Posted by Element

On the subject of battery cut outs here is a tip from the racing world that can save you a little bit of money.

Many European cars like BMW's and Audi's are shipped with a high quality Hella brand electrical cut off switch wired to thick OEM quality wires as part of a transportation harness that is removed and discarded when the cars arrive at the dealership. Yes that is right, these really nice harnesses are literally thrown away by the dealership!

Racers caught on to this years ago so if you go to a BMW or Audi dealership and ask them for some of these harnesses they will normally be happy to give them to you. With it not only will you save a lot of money but also most of the work will be done for you making it easy to wire an OEM quality harness to your Sportsmobile.

Wow---what an amazing bit of great info---thanks Rob!

I never really thought about transporting imported vehicles across the seas etc.

Now watch---there'll be a run on BMW and Audi dealerships people asking for these. Next these harnesses will have part numbers and prices assigned!