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Old 03-01-2019, 08:48 PM   #1
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Electrical layout review

Hey guys,

wanted to see if i could get a second set of eyes to review my electrical diagram and give me your thoughts.

main components:
- 350Ah 8D battery
- Redarc manager30 BMS (~50a max input from shore/DC/Solar, 30a output to house battery)
- 250a blue sea bus bar (common ground)


the diagram shows one 12 blade fuse block but its close to maxxed out (95a out of 100a) with whats in it so im going with 2 fuse blocks, a 6-blade for essentials and a 12-blade for nonessentials.

Load run down
Essentials
Espar 2D - 20a fuse
Espar Controller - 5a fuse
Maxx Air 6100 - 10a fuse
Fridge - 15a fuse

Non-Essentials
8 x Acegoo LED Pucks - 5a fuse
USB c/a outlet - 10a fuse
USB c/a outlet - 10a fuse
USB c/a outlet - 10a fuse
USB c/a outlet - 10a fuse

Wire Sizing
Load
Starter battery -> BMS - 6awg
BMS -> House battery - 6awg
House battery -> fuse block - 4awg
House battery -> fuse block - 4awg

Ground
House battery -> Sensor/Shunt - 6awg
Sensor/Shunt -> Common ground - 6awg
Fuse Block -> Common ground - 4awg
Fuse Block -> Common ground - 4awg
Common ground -> Frame - 2|0awg

accessory wiring isnt a big concern, thats why it was not included. just want some of the higher amp wiring looked over. run distances for SB2BMS is <10' and BMS2HB < 3' all other cables runs are <3'
Attached Thumbnails
Electrical Design.jpg  
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Old 03-02-2019, 06:59 AM   #2
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I like the concept of the Redarc Manager30 BMS, I believe that 30 amps is low for a shore charger and a 350Ah 8D battery. I suspect that isn't going to be a primary mode for you anyway.

Your Diagram does not show ground from Manager 30 BMS to ground. Your house battery to sensor/shunt and from sensor/shunt to ground bar are not correctly sized, also there is no need for 2/0 from frame to ground bar.


The bus-bar to the house battery via sensor/shunt should your worse case load . You are showing 4 awg from Fuse block to bus-bar, but then go down to 6 awg from bus bar to battery, the same or most likely more current will be going through the bus-bar to battery, The same or more current needs to travel through that cable. I did not see in my quick glance at manual the specification for sensor/shunt, what is it's maximum current carrying capability. Also when sizing this take into account any other possible upgrades you might want.


From the diagram the only load that is coming via the vehicle frame would be the starting battery to BMS, unless there are other significant loads coming from vehicle I don't see a need for 2/0 awg. I generally would make it the same size wire as my bus-bar to ground .

you did not specify what type of cable you will be using as in temp rating, it is needed for wire size calculations.

I haven't finished my first cup of coffee, so I may have missed something.


-greg
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Old 03-02-2019, 08:05 AM   #3
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The (NOT Electrical) engineer in me reads “Revise and Resubmit”. Nice job Greg, very helpful comments for DHwreckage to work with.
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Old 03-02-2019, 09:56 AM   #4
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Greg thanks for taking the time to looks this over, this is why I needed a second set of eyes... I totally blanked on drawing up the ground to the BMS, it would be a 6awg cable to the common ground and I will switch to 4awg for house battery ground run and replace the 2/0 with 4awg to tie bus bar to the frame.


The wire I was looking at is stranded welding cable rated for temps between -50C to 105C and rated for 600volts. The only wire that will be outside for a few feet is the starter battery to BMS run and the common ground to frame. And for the 2 lugs terminating outside I will be using tinned copper and adhesive heat shrink wrap to protect the copper cable from the elements.The shunt is rated for 300 amps which is well above my normal demand even with momentary spikes

30amps is a little on the low side I agree, but battery specs say 20-100 amp for charging. Correct me if I'm wrong but I think it should be adequate for my needs. I'd rather know now that this won't work then after it is all inside!

Shore power will mostly be used at home for storage as I don't anticipate a whole lot of shore where we will be using this. Solar panels will be installed in the next month or so which should be able to keep the batterys topped up during the day, weather dependent, and the 350ah battery should have plenty of capacity for up to 3-4days of no charging with our loads and the DOD limit I am using.

Did I miss anything else?
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Old 03-02-2019, 02:08 PM   #5
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DH,
I would go along with what ever your battery manufacture says, what type of battery? In general I would recommend .2C rate for the battery, which would put it at 70 amps for an Lifeline AGM battery.

Like I said I like the concept, but the manager 30 list around 1200.00. I can get these items and perform the same tasks.
KISAE AC1260 Abso 60A $319.00

KISAE DMT1250 Abso 50A DC-DC Battery Charger $349.00

Balmar SG200 battery monitor $220.00


If you haven't already purchased your welding wire, I would look at marine wire, Bestboatwire,com has good prices, they also sell tinned copper cable lugs.


Your fuse blocks are your big loads. I suspect you may get by with one, you can over populate the block over 100 amps as long as you are sure you won't ever be pulling max current for all the loads at the same time. This is where a resettable breaker comes in handy as the block would have to be fused for max load still (125 Amp Max or lower)

You might want to increase the wire size on the battery to bus bar to 2 awg for future additions.

The fuses directly off of your battery are considered main fuses and need to support correct AIC, or be behind one that does support AIC.

greg
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Old 03-04-2019, 08:04 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scalf77 View Post
DH,
I would go along with what ever your battery manufacture says, what type of battery? In general I would recommend .2C rate for the battery, which would put it at 70 amps for an Lifeline AGM battery.

Like I said I like the concept, but the manager 30 list around 1200.00. I can get these items and perform the same tasks.
KISAE AC1260 Abso 60A $319.00

KISAE DMT1250 Abso 50A DC-DC Battery Charger $349.00

Balmar SG200 battery monitor $220.00


If you haven't already purchased your welding wire, I would look at marine wire, Bestboatwire,com has good prices, they also sell tinned copper cable lugs.


Your fuse blocks are your big loads. I suspect you may get by with one, you can over populate the block over 100 amps as long as you are sure you won't ever be pulling max current for all the loads at the same time. This is where a resettable breaker comes in handy as the block would have to be fused for max load still (125 Amp Max or lower)

You might want to increase the wire size on the battery to bus bar to 2 awg for future additions.

The fuses directly off of your battery are considered main fuses and need to support correct AIC, or be behind one that does support AIC.

greg
Scalf,

Thanks a bunch for your input, im looking at a few other options for charging thanks to your inputs. also i am going to consolidate the electrical back to one fuse block, and switch to a manually resettable breaker for the starter battery to BMS and from the house battery to the fuse block and just carry a spare breaker in case one of them shits the bed. and thats a good point on upping the house battery ground to 2awg for the future since it wont really increase the costs at all. going to order wire today so i ca hopeully start laying it out before the weekend. one more quick question, should i look at using tinned wire for the wire runs that go outside the truck? i was planning on using tinned lugs and sealing out the environment with adhesive heat shrink and running plastic loom on the outside to prevents damage.

I really appreciate you sharing your expertise on this subject with me!!
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Old 03-04-2019, 09:31 AM   #7
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No problem, it is always nice to bounce your ideas off of someone. I use pretty much use "marine" or tinned wire generally everywhere. That is a personal choice, the big thing that you need to consider if not using is to make sure you use the correct ampacity charts for the wire you choose. A common circuit wizard reference in this forum Circuit Wizard - Blue Sea Systems is based off of tinned wire. The tinned wire has slightly higher ampacity. Also be careful about getting aluminum or copper clad aluminum wire.

The use of tinned lugs and adhesive lined shrink wrap is good practice. I generally use circuit breakers in limited application, The circuit wizard mentioned above will give you good choices fuses or circuit breakers especially if for a main fuse location.

-greg
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