Are Ford 6.0's worth it?

[saline]

Originally Posted by Gr8ful

I've owned many 12 valve Cummins & now this IDI also. I can buy a set of injectors for either of these for under $300/set. The Powestokes are over $3,000. per set so I now know where the name Stroke came from.

Cool story

[daveb]

Originally Posted by 86Scotty

Agreed, For my part I was just messing around.

Me to!

[Jdkh2001]

Originally Posted by unreng

There's enough information about powerstroke 6.0's on web forums to fill a few encyclopedia's, but this should get the ball rolling...

Talk to reputable mechanics who repair diesels, and a powerstroke 6.0 is a good engine, if:
1. it's maintained...religiously. meaning, only use quality filters (International or Motorcraft/Ford), oil (synthetic 5w40), sensors (international or Ford/Motorcraft), fuel, etc. and stick to the recommended maintenance intervals.
2. it's built how it should have been from the factory. Ford & International saved money on the design where some extra dollars would've ensured longevity. F&I also changed diesel design from the 7.3 to 6.0, which brought it's own issues.
3. read / study / learn the engine to know how it operates, and the general issues that can occur. understand the shortcuts Ford created to shoehorn the 6.0 diesel in a van, and the potential remedies.
4. there are upgrades available to make a 6.0 diesel a robust engine...ask a lot of questions, and request maintenance history, for any 6.0 diesel you're considering.

carringb used to own a diesel shop, so there's an invaluable resource.

definitely do your homework...compare a 6.0 diesel to the 6.8 gas.
the 6.0 diesel can be a wonderful engine, but it requires more user/owner awareness.
the 6.8 gas appears to be more user friendly.
a cost-benefit comparison of the two engines should help decide.

some websites to read:
https://oregonfuelinjection.com/serv...gnostics/#2003
https://www.littlepowershop.com/comm...ues-and-fixes/
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/forum107/ - the tech folder is extremely helpful
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/3...ch-folder.html
https://www.powerstroke.org/forum/6-...ning-6-0l.html
Things to consider about owning a 6.0L
Here is the deal with the 6.0. Any good tuner (person writing your tunes) is not going to give you a tune that is going to tear up your truck. There are trucks all over the place running 400-420 rwhp with 750-800 rwtq all day long without problems.

Yes the 6.0 is known to blow head gaskets. This is why it happens. The Ford Gold coolant contains silicates. The silicates are not able to handle high EGT's generated by a good load or relatively high boost when they run through the EGR cooler. They break down into a gell like sludge and fall out of suspension. This crud gets caught up in the tiny coolant passageways of the oil cooler. As the cooler clogs up it restricts coolant flow to the egr cooler. Now the egr cooler doesn't have enough coolant to carry off the heat generated by high EGT's. The limited amount of coolant in the egr cooler flash boils causing high pressure in the cooling system and the truck pukes coolant from the degass bottle due to the pressure. (it has to go somewhere)
Your uninformed Powerstroke owner is not monitoring his coolant temps and oil temps so he doesn't know whats going on and he keeps driving it this way. The problem gets worse, the pressure causes the egr cooler to rupture. Now the egr cooler is leaking coolant into the intake manifold which then runs into the cylinders. Again the high combustion temps cause the coolant to vaporize. This causes unacceptably high cylinder pressure, the TTY head bolts stretch due to the add'l pressure and there go your head gaskets.

Ok now you know the problem. Here's the cure. Get a good engine monitoring solution like the Edge Insight so that you can monitor your ECT and EOT. If those temps get more than 15* apart with normal cruising when at normal operating temperature your oil cooler is clogging up. Rebuild it now to prevent all that down stream damage from occurring. Flush that Ford Gold coolant crap out of your engine with a couple bottles of Restore. This is made specifically to clean out that silicate residue. Now refill it with a silicate free Cat EC-1 rated ELC coolant. This removes the silicates that clog the oil cooler from the equation. If you live in an area where you don't have smog inspections delete the egr system. If you can't delete it replace the egr cooler with the cooler manufactured by Bulletproof Diesel. This is vastly superior to the Ford oem egr cooler and it will not fail on you. If you find that you need to replace head gaskets replace the TTY head bolts with ARP studs and use OEM Ford head gaskets, the black onyx (Victor Reinz) head gaskets have proven to have a high failure rate. If you have to replace the egr cooler always replace the oil cooler. That is the source of the problem.

Now that you have addressed the common problems that scare the he11 out of people, get an SCT tuner (i like the X3) and install some custom tunes and drive the heck out of it. DO NOT baby it. The Powerstroke hates this and will rebel with turbo issues.

Turbo issues are also common repair points with the 6.0. People like to complain that it's because the VGT turbos are pieces of junk. This is not so. The VGT vanes in the turbo need to be exercised regularly. This means making them go through their full range of motion. So put your foot in it regularly and let it see some full boost runs. That will keep your VGT vanes from getting all sooted up and freezing up because of the soot. Again, that is what happens when you baby it. Put your foot in it and you will have less problems. Lay out of it and try to milk it for mileage like you would a gasser and you're going to have turbo issues. Don't let it sit either. That is also the kiss of death to the turbo. The unison ring rusts up and again you have turbo problems. So now that you know you need to give your turbo a regular work out to keep it happy, give it a proper cool down as well. Just whipping into your parking place and shutting it down will lead to coking the bearings and again major turbo issues. Running a good synthetic oil will help here immensely because it handles heat so much better and resists coking. But always let your turbo have time to cool down. This is one of the reasons you need a Pyrometer (EGT gauge). Let the EGT come down to 350* before shutting your truck off. This only takes a couple of minutes, especially if you take it easy on it for the last couple minutes of your trip. If this is too much hassle for you get a turbo timer that will automatically delay shutdown when you turn off the key to allow the turbo to cool down.

Injectors. Ford's HEUI injection system fires the injectors with High Pressure Oil, to the tune of 4,000psi at Wide Open Throttle. Maintenance is critical here so you can not let your oil maintenance slide like you can on a gasser. It will kill your injectors. The injectors also are known to suffer from something that we call stiction. That is when the oil side plunger of the injector hangs up or sticks when cold until the truck warms up. I believe this is caused by varnish buildup that is common to dino oils, especially those containing paraffin. Using a good synthetic oil will take care of that because it actually cleans the engine as it lubricates. If you do find yourself with some injector stiction add a couple of bottles of Rev-X to your oil. It has cleared up 99.9% of the trucks it has been used on. 2 bottles run around $70. A new injector is about $250-$290. Be anal about keeping your oil clean and fresh and changing your fuel filters regularly. The other thing that kills injectors is low fuel pressure. The fuel pressure needs to stay above 45psi at all times and is typically set around 52 psi from the factory. Well the factory fuel pressure regulator spring is weak and looses it's tension over time and can't maintain adequate fuel pressure. There is an updated rebuild kit that uses a better, stronger spring. Installing this spring will bring your fuel pressure up to about 62 psi and solve that. Get a fuel pressure gauge. It's important.

So that covers the frequent complaints with the 6.0. They are all well known at this point as are the solutions. Does it suck we have to fix Ford's blunders? Heck yes it does. But again we know how and once done you will have a very reliable robust truck that is well worth the effort. So address the issues as you can and enjoy your truck. It is a dynamite vehicle. I love mine.

Regards.
Chris

This is the most thorough and objective info I have ever read about my 6.0 diesel motor so thank you Chris this is really good stuff to know.

[JoeH]

Yes, nice write-up pasted from the powerstroke.org forum. Although I'm not a fan of using harsh chemicals like Restore. I'd just do a flush with a gazillion gallons of distilled water. If one does go the Restore route for sure replace the oil cooler because it's going to clog up if it hadn't already. Also, if you have a 2003-2004 then the EGR cooler is ok. Those years are not known to fail. In 2004 is when they went to the square tube version.

[arctictraveller]

Originally Posted by Gr8ful

arctictraveller we do agree that you know nothing about diesels.

Actually, I know quite a bit about diesels. I've owned diesel powered boats half my life, and prior to retirement, i was chief engineer aboard mid sized cruise ships for many years, responsible for up to 7 or more engines from hundreds of horsepower, up to several thousand each. What I don't know much about are Ford truck engines. That's because I prefer the simplicity, low maintenance cost, and reliably of my gas motor. Ok, I've got my Nomex Fire proof suit on, flame away......

[arctictraveller]

Originally Posted by TomsBeast

Ahhhhh... the popular 'casting sand clogging the egr cooler' theory never made sense to me. It's the 'new and improved gold coolant' crystallizing when it gets locally super heated inside the egr

Most interesting. Silicates in coolant have always been an issue in Diesel engines, mostly in those with wet liners, but for a different reason. Those coolants tend to cavitate when the cylinder liner "rings". That's to say, as the liner vibrates when the combustion stroke happens, bubbles form and then collapse along the sides of the liner, eventually causing pitting of the liner, and worse case, causing pinholes. SCAs (supplemental coolant additives) can be added to retard this process, but they eventually wear out and must be monitored and replenished as needed. Extended life coolants such as my favorite, Cat ELC, have no silicates and long lasting additive packages. Another source of sludge formation clogging coolers is the mixing of different brands and types of coolants.

[BroncoHauler]

Originally Posted by arctictraveller

Most interesting. Silicates in coolant have always been an issue in Diesel engines, mostly in those with wet liners, but for a different reason. Those coolants tend to cavitate when the cylinder liner "rings". That's to say, as the liner vibrates when the combustion stroke happens, bubbles form and then collapse along the sides of the liner, eventually causing pitting of the liner, and worse case, causing pinholes. ....

Look who's showing off their diesel knowledge!




Herb

[TomsBeast]

Originally Posted by BroncoHauler

Look who's showing off their diesel knowledge!

Herb

When you know your stuff, you know your stuff


This forum is lucky to have smart and experienced guys like Arctic contributing, and tamely responding to some nubi throwing rocks
(referring to an ungrateful comment made earlier, that I see has been removed)

[Offroading_is_Fun]

I'm pretty sure I'll get in trouble for the gas-vs-diesel nature of this...

Doesn't seem too long ago that I saw Herb say something along the lines of, "The 5.4L will get the job done, the 6.8L will get the job done better, and the 6.0 PSD will get the job done, until it doesn't" and someone had a FTFY moment and added "until it doesn't, and it will cost several thousand dollars to make it right again".

It might have even been this very thread where it was said (impossible to read everything on mobile.).

Personal $0.02 is that if you are thinking about a diesel, I would lean towards the 7.3. there is a shop up here in Kalispell that (I believe) have also dumped a 5.9L 12/24V Cummins into an E350 as well. Really the issues that diesels seem to have that I have seen in vans are heat and emissions related.

If you aren't absolutely adamant about having a diesel, I think it would be very worthwhile to ask yourself if a tuned V10 SMB would fit what you need it to do. Not trying to poo-poo on the diesels, just saying that it seems the V10's are less finnicky and if they do have problems that they tend to have cheaper fixes.

[Gr8ful]

https://autowise.com/ford-diesel-engine-history/ Ford diesels
Later is Better: If you have a choice, select the newest-model Ford IDI you can find, with the ’93 to ’94 years being best. You’ll get a better glow plug controller (D), serpentine belt system, and the turbo engine comes with stronger connecting rods. The 7.3L is desired more than the 6.9L because it has larger, ½-inch head bolts instead of 7⁄16-inch versions.

There are tens of thousands of 12 valve 5.9 Cummins that have broke 1 million miles towing RVs for a living & many have broken 2 million. Do that on a gas engine pulling!