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Old 02-17-2022, 06:17 PM   #1
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POR15 seems like a bad idea for a van floor. Am I wrong?

I don't mean to beat a dead horse here, but I'm guilty of falling into deep void that every minor van build detail leads to if you poke around enough!

There are hundreds of anecdotes on various forums (including this one) about POR15, and much of it is praise. I have seen in general that the forums with higher concentrations of auto body guys have a less popular opinion of POR15.

I was about to pull the trigger on some POR15 in order to coat and seal the floor of my van as the first step of my van conversion before the insulation and subfloor go in. A few exceptional van builds on this forum made use of it for sealing the van tub. But, I just haven't been able to go through with purchasing it, because every bit of logic seems to indicate that this is the wrong product to use. Let me explain why:

1) It's a rust encapsulator. My van floor is 98% rust free. It can be applied to roughened, clean metal, but why? It's a rust encapsulator. It's meant to be Painted Over Rust. It's a moisture cured urethane that can be painted over the surface of rust and draw out the moisture in the rust in its curing process and create a starved environment and great seal. However, this seems heavily dependent on near perfect prep and atmospheric conditions. As a side note, there are a lot of guys on the auto body/restoration type forums that regard any rust encapsulator as, ultimately, the result of a "that'll do" attitude of the hobbyist or money-strapped enthusiast who refuses to do the job correctly by simply eliminating the the rust in the first place.

2) POR15 cures into a very hard and rigid material. Yes, it's very durable, but also has very little flex. Will this present problems as the body of my van flexes offroad? What about the dissimilar expansion and contraction rates of the POR15 and the underlying metal? The last thing I want is for cracks to form in the POR15, creating perfect little rust hotels.

3) It's more expensive than epoxies or enamels that seem to be better suited for metals that are properly prepped and rust free.

I don't doubt that people have gotten good results with it on clean metal, especially a van floor that will be hidden from exposure, but I'm trying to figure out why it would be the first choice.

What's the alternative? Well, my thinking is to hit any spots of surface rust that are in seams or hard to reach places that I absolutely cannot grind out with a rust converter like Ospho or SEM Rust Mort. Will any such places actually exist? I don't know. And then paint it with an epoxy or enamel. I haven't been able to find a single bad thing said about SEM Rust-Shield, an enamel, and it does not require the etching acid that POR15 does for clean metal. On the other hand, epoxy is cheap, durable, and flexible.

Please excuse the rabbit hole induced rant
Am I missing something here?

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Old 02-17-2022, 06:44 PM   #2
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As one of the POR-15 fans I do not see anything wrong with an excellent adhering epoxy.

The idea for me is creating the water proof barrier between the inevitable water spill that goes below the flooring and the metal floor. The water spill will be present for near forever until the floor is pulled up and allowed to dry.

As to floor flex and POR 15 cracking, that would definitely surprise me. I will find out in a couple months when I pull my entire interior out for redo. The POR15 coating has been down for about 5 years and quite a bit of offroad as well as a couple of water leak situation that will have tested its barrier capability very thoroughly.

The OEM floor surfaces were mostly free of surface rust but there were a few spots were moisture had been present and surface speckles were visible before prep and painting.

From 2017:
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Old 02-17-2022, 07:06 PM   #3
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Thanks for the response and pictures! It looks REALLY nice! My contention here, I suppose, is that POR15 does not have any superior water proofing or sealing quality and I am worried that it will not "bite" as well as an epoxy or paint due to it inherently needing the pitted, rough surface of rust to adhere.

I admire your retention of the rear HVAC. I really wanted rip that thing out of my passenger van but was convinced by your advice (and a few others like caringb) to figure out how to build around it or regret it in the summer.

Oh, and I got my swivel seat from your latest batch a few weeks ago. Really quick shipment. I'm excited to get that thing bolted in, thanks!
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Old 02-17-2022, 09:44 PM   #4
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I did the same when I gutted my rig, all I can say is this stuff, once down, has some serious bite, I am fairly confident that it will not flake, chip or degrade. I’m curious to find out why those in the auto industry you had read about were not recommending this stuff, maybe they were referring to panels that were so far gone and were really needing to be replaced vs “the bandaid” approach. In that case, yes this would not be product to use.
I think I was able to thoroughly coat my entire floor with one quart, I could be wrong on that, but a little does seem to go a long way.
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Old 02-17-2022, 10:07 PM   #5
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Only use por 15 on the rusty spots. It's expensive, and doesn't do anything except adhere poorly to non rusty spots.
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Old 02-18-2022, 12:29 AM   #6
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REF: Your build thread is a great resource and I've read it several times. I think the auto body guys dislike the stuff because there are plentiful examples of it failing, not just with sloppy applications but with earnest ones, and this could be for a variety of reasons, I suppose. There isn't really a reason to paint over rust if you have the time or the means to just correctly address it, especially when you have the possibility of an angry customer returning six months later with rust bubbles forming in their new paint job.

I was curious about your application technique. Did you do the recommended two coats? I know you have to apply the second coat before the first totally dries, and it seems like crawling around on uncured POR15 while doing the second coat would cause some imperfections. I've been trying to visualize how to do that.

rallypanam: Yes, I've heard it especially cannot bond to existing paint.
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Old 02-18-2022, 07:30 AM   #7
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OP - not sure if it helps but in this thread I linked a couple videos of an auto tech who thoroughly tests various rust encapsulants, including POR15

https://www.sportsmobileforum.com/fo...ost306776.html
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Old 02-18-2022, 07:50 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rallypanam View Post
Only use por 15 on the rusty spots. It's expensive, and doesn't do anything except adhere poorly to non rusty spots.
Are you bad mouthing Eric's (86Scotty's) van Rusty?


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Old 02-18-2022, 08:09 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by motovan_mn View Post
OP - not sure if it helps but in this thread I linked a couple videos of an auto tech who thoroughly tests various rust encapsulants, including POR15

https://www.sportsmobileforum.com/fo...ost306776.html
I thought these videos on testing were really well done. Thanks for those links!
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Old 02-18-2022, 10:24 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rallypanam View Post
Only use por 15 on the rusty spots. It's expensive, and doesn't do anything except adhere poorly to non rusty spots.
auto body guy, my experience as well. used it all over a trailer that we rebuilt a few years ago and it's flaking off in sheets. That being said we didn't necessary follow the mfg recommendations we used it like our paint vendor told us to as a direct to metal primer on a sandblasted surface but we trusted the guy, our mistake.
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