Code of conduct?

[VocalVirgo]

Originally Posted by BrianW

I agree with erring on the side of civility. While I think the recent threads about SMBW had valid concerns that warranted being raised and publicly discussed, I also personally felt that quite a few of the posts went beyond discussing the business and moved into highly personal attacks on certain SMBW employees that were pretty close to defamation IMO. The one poster's points have been made - repeatedly in multiple threads.

I have to disagree with one thing, my comments were truthful. There was no defamation. The things that their secretary said to me actually happened. I have her recorded. It was very strange, it bordered on sexual-harassment and then she weirdly went into this homophobic, Bible-Thumping rant. Telling me that I’m not going to heaven and calling me ugly, has nothing to do with her job. Jonathan acknowledged he has had a few similar issues with her and other customers. So no defamation.

And for the record, I was a fanboy since I was a teenager. I have wanted to have one of these since forever. Talk about having a childhood dream shattered. I mean, you might as well have just shot Bambi‘s mother right in front of me, LOL.
#LoveOneAnother

[BroncoHauler]

FYI, there have already been comments on this thread by two moderators (Site Team), and this thread will remain open as long as it remains civil, and as long as it doesn't end up being a duplicate of the other threads that exist on this topic.




herb

[Janet H]

We have merged two threads about the same issue and I just wanted to clarify a few things regarding moderation questions and thread closures.

1. Where there are disputes between customers and vendors and accusations are made about improper conduct the forum finds itself drawn into the spat. One side posts their story, then often the other side posts theirs and then the lawyers contact us with defamation concerns. We get drawn into the mess and have no way to suss out where the real truth lies. This is why we ask you to settle your differences in the appropriate venue - small claims court, the BBB, etc.

2. Censorship: The site has some basic rules and the site team is tasked to keep the tires on the road within those parameters. If you have a moderation concern send a Pm to a moderator. We rarely edit or remove content and when we do the involved parties generally get a notice about it. The site rules are pretty basic - paraphrasing here... "be nice, be reasonable, be appropriate"

3. Thread removals and closures - doesn't happen often but if it does... ask before you repost the content. There was a reason the action was taken... see item 1 above.

[VocalVirgo]

Originally Posted by Janet H

We have merged two threads about the same issue and I just wanted to clarify a few things regarding moderation questions and thread closures.

1. Where there are disputes between customers and vendors and accusations are made about improper conduct the forum finds itself drawn into the spat. One side posts their story, then often the other side posts theirs and then the lawyers contact us with defamation concerns. We get drawn into the mess and have no way to suss out where the real truth lies. This is why we ask you to settle your differences in the appropriate venue - small claims court, the BBB, etc.

2. Censorship: The site has some basic rules and the site team is tasked to keep the tires on the road within those parameters. If you have a moderation concern send a Pm to a moderator. We rarely edit or remove content and when we do the involved parties generally get a notice about it. The site rules are pretty basic - paraphrasing here... "be nice, be reasonable, be appropriate"

3. Thread removals and closures - doesn't happen often but if it does... ask before you repost the content. There was a reason the action was taken... see item 1 above.

I appreciate this response, and how civil it was. Honestly.
Thank you :-).

And yes, I heard that their lawyers like to use comments made by disgruntled customers in this site, as grounds for defamation. That’s a tough position to be put in, and I fully respect it.

The bottom line is that SMBW is desperately trying to stop me from posting the videos and pictures. Once shared on social media, it would be very embarrassing for them and they would like that not to happen. So, I am politely waiting to see if/how they will accommodate me and fix what they installed poorly. And apologize to me, in writing. Without that, the videos and pictures get shared with all on social media. Trust me, they don’t want that. We are no longer using a lawyer so they have a short window to do the right thing. I personally do not think they will. And these videos and pictures are legally my intellectual property, and can be shared at any time. They will have to eat crow to save face. To be totally honest, I am giving them time to think about what is best for their customers, but I think they only care about themselves. My videos and pictures will tarnish Sportsmobile the company, not just SMBW. I’d rather them do the right thing than force me to take the lie toad and post my stuff. But ultimately, it’s up to them. I’ve been patient, but it’s wearing thin.
I don’t care about the van itself anymore, as I’m selling it cheap just to get SMBW away from me. But I will not hesitate to post my stuff all over social media if the continue to be what I call “Alan Feld & Son Stubborn”.

You just can’t treat customers this way.
Advanced RV would never behave like this.

[JWA]

Originally Posted by VocalVirgo

I appreciate this response, and how civil it was. Honestly.
Thank you :-).

And yes, I heard that their lawyers like to use comments made by disgruntled customers in this site, as grounds for defamation. That’s a tough position to be put in, and I fully respect it.

The bottom line is that SMBW is desperately trying to stop me from posting the videos and pictures. Once shared on social media, it would be very embarrassing for them and they would like that not to happen. So, I am politely waiting to see if/how they will accommodate me and fix what they installed poorly. And apologize to me, in writing. Without that, the videos and pictures get shared with all on social media. Trust me, they don’t want that. We are no longer using a lawyer so they have a short window to do the right thing. I personally do not think they will. And these videos and pictures are legally my intellectual property, and can be shared at any time. They will have to eat crow to save face. To be totally honest, I am giving them time to think about what is best for their customers, but I think they only care about themselves. My videos and pictures will tarnish Sportsmobile the company, not just SMBW. I’d rather them do the right thing than force me to take the lie toad and post my stuff. But ultimately, it’s up to them. I’ve been patient, but it’s wearing thin.
I don’t care about the van itself anymore, as I’m selling it cheap just to get SMBW away from me. But I will not hesitate to post my stuff all over social media if the continue to be what I call “Alan Feld & Son Stubborn”.

You just can’t treat customers this way.
Advanced RV would never behave like this.

I'm not a lawyer nor an SMB Forum Moderator but honestly it seems you're ignoring polite, friendly and firm advice how or what NOT to post here. If I were one of these "politically correct" types I'd see a lot of threats or promises of impending actions (same thing really) which does go against SMB's policy as well as feeds the lawyers who might see benefit in such public statements.

I feel you made your case in the first post which is good---I said as much in the closed thread. That information hasn't been removed so its basically in the public domain, available for anyone doing a basic search to review and make choices based upon your experiences.

From my POV and limited comprehension it seems you're ignoring advice from the Site Team which is a certain way to have your content removed from public display. If your goal is to keep this information present and visible to searches don't ignore advice from those in positions to remove it from sight.

I get it---you're pissed about poor quality and poor customer service---in a similar position we'd all feel the same. I hope this is resolved in your favor and everything is worked out to your satisfaction. If that involves selling the vehicle with full disclosure to the new owner of your concerns and issues so be it.

That might not be your wanted end result with SMBW but it does allow you to move forward and not fight until the death about something resolved. Its a waste of energy and emotions you could use for other parts of "life".

Best of luck in all this VV!

[mikracer]

This thread wasnt created to rehash what has already been posted, but to get clarification which Janet H has done.

VocalVirgo, I understand your frustrations and hope you receive a proper outcome.
Hopefully the original thread or a thread can remain open so people can see what ends up happening.

[JWA]

Originally Posted by mikracer

This thread wasnt created to rehash what has already been posted, but to get clarification which Janet H has done.

A simple PM to Janet H would have served the same purpose much better then.

Originally Posted by mikracer

VocalVirgo, I understand your frustrations and hope you receive a proper outcome.
Hopefully the original thread or a thread can remain open so people can see what ends up happening.

We all do and that was expressed in the now-closed thread. Any bonafide movement or resolution would be well received I'm sure. I hate seeing anyone on the wrong side of a vendor.

A vendor's reputation is made better by resolving issues like VocalVirgo has outlined for us here. It's difficult they're willing to cold shoulder anyone knowing its very easy to have it all play out in the court of public opinion.

Anyway best of luck with this VocalVirgo---really hope you do well.

[VocalVirgo]

Originally Posted by JWA

I'm not a lawyer nor an SMB Forum Moderator but honestly it seems you're ignoring polite, friendly and firm advice how or what NOT to post here. If I were one of these "politically correct" types I'd see a lot of threats or promises of impending actions (same thing really) which does go against SMB's policy as well as feeds the lawyers who might see benefit in such public statements.

I feel you made your case in the first post which is good---I said as much in the closed thread. That information hasn't been removed so its basically in the public domain, available for anyone doing a basic search to review and make choices based upon your experiences.

From my POV and limited comprehension it seems you're ignoring advice from the Site Team which is a certain way to have your content removed from public display. If your goal is to keep this information present and visible to searches don't ignore advice from those in positions to remove it from sight.

I get it---you're pissed about poor quality and poor customer service---in a similar position we'd all feel the same. I hope this is resolved in your favor and everything is worked out to your satisfaction. If that involves selling the vehicle with full disclosure to the new owner of your concerns and issues so be it.

That might not be your wanted end result with SMBW but it does allow you to move forward and not fight until the death about something resolved. Its a waste of energy and emotions you could use for other parts of "life".

Best of luck in all this VV!

Thank you for this. I read it twice and I understand that everything you wrote has merit, except for what their lawyer can search, see, and use against me. All of it is the truth, so no legal ramifications to worry about. (besides, they only use their lawyer when a customer goes after them for bad repairs or refusal of warranty work – they don’t waste their money otherwise, LOL.)

But everything you said about the other post still being up and other people in this form still being able to see it and reference it, and understand it, it’s true. I will let this dog sleep for a while. Thank you for the good advice.

I am indeed selling the van. Sports Mobile Texas has agreed to take over the warranty, and I assume North will do the same thing. And of course I will tell the new owner everything, I’m not a shady crook. We fixed everything in the van ourselves. The top goes up, the top goes down, and there are no leaks. I would never sell this van if it had problems still. I would never do that to someone. So, I’m hoping that someone sees this as a great opportunity and an amazing deal for $45,000. I mean, the van only has 23,000 miles on it, and it’s a beautiful build out. Someone will fall in love with it and snap it right up. And I hope they enjoy the H*ll out of it, as I should have been able to do, truly.

Thanks again.

[mikracer]

Originally Posted by JWA

A simple PM to Janet H would have served the same purpose much better then.

Not in my opinion. Again, this thread wasn't created for VV to continue posting to defend his statements or continue his rant. He could have started new threads for that. I merely stated my opinion on threads being closed because someone had a negative experience with a vendor.

[Janet H]

Originally Posted by mikracer

Not in my opinion. Again, this thread wasn't created for VV to continue posting to defend his statements or continue his rant. He could have started new threads for that. I merely stated my opinion on threads being closed because someone had a negative experience with a vendor.

This site is not affiliated with any dealer or Sportsmobile itself and we don't "protect" them. The site is independently run and the moderators are volunteers

While most topics are fair game, where they wander into legal-land we may close them. There are a number of reasons for this.

• Posting accusations generally results in either the other party or their lawyers showing up to dispute them and the forum gets dragged into the middle. We are a tiny forum and lawyering up is expensive - especially when it's someone elses battle.
• We have no way to ascertain the veracity of the claims
• Businesses are vulnerable to claims of bad practices or products by folks who are mad. While there are surely instances where the customer is right, there are cases where the customer is unreasonable. These claims can badly damage the reputation of a company and remain on the internet long after the immediate issue is resolved. When that happens the publishing platform (this board) can be held responsible for allowing this material to remain.

There is a big difference between a "negative experience" and a determined stance to continually post about an issue that is in process of some resolution. There have been multiple posts about this issue on several threads. It has gotten personal with details and names. This is the reason for thread closure.

The forum is not the venue to resolve this. We hold no sway over the involved parties and don't want the platform used to coerce an outcome or to be dragged into the mess. While these posts are still visible we closed the topics because it seemed that this might be moving in that direction. We are trying to find a middle ground here and have left this content up for anyone to view.

Thanks for understanding.