Warning to 6.0 PSD Owners with Amsoil System

[Jeffrey]

Greg and sdwindandsea are both right. Thread sealer is useless and possibly counter-effective on threads that are not sealing threads such as NPT. The oil line connector threads simply attach the hoses, and the ends of the connectors are either tapered or radiused, as with a hydraulic port, and that's where the sealing takes place.

[Gene Atl.Beach]

I have 20k on mine and change to the Amsoil system at 6400 miles. I have changed oil as I should but didn't know about the flow problem. I just finished switching the lines on the adapter, removed the restrictor and spring above the Donaldson filter. I have done pipe fitting all of my life. Flare fittings should not required anything extra to seal the oil from leaking, BUT, my experiance says to me, a SMALL amount of telfon tape will help seal this type of oil from leaking. I do not like any leaks.. I used two rounds of tape, careful not to over lap the tape so that putting on the female fitting gets any extra or overlap. Rap from top to right, under, back over twice... turn female fitting to right of course... this way you will not buckel the tape... tape will flow with the right turn of the female fitting... This explanation is for those with a degree in compter science and not mechanics..hope this helps. I started the engine after filling with 16.5 qts Amsoil.....and waited... 10 min. the top of both filters started to heat up... Right now, I'm pleased. Jim talked me though part of the restrictor problem.. He's very good and knows what he's doing in my opinon. You couldn't ask for any better help than Jim. Gene

[jcgreatoil]

OK, Everyone, this is my final post on the restrictor issue. I have been an Amsoil dealer for 33 years. I have specialized in the Big Rig market for the last 20 years. http://www.thegreatestoil.com. You can check out some of my truck pics. I have personally installed at least 60 kits during that time. 22 were Cummins powered Gradall forklifts. Same system all of you have. 5 years they have been running, all without restrictors, all were installed using teflon tape on all fittings. I have done cars, pickups, big trucks and heavy equipment so I think I know what I am doing. Those fittings were not designed for synthetic oil, so on the first ones I did they leaked and seeped. Tightening did not work so I started using teflon tape and no more problems, plus later if you need to take them off they come off without damage. I also put oil on both ends to prevent galding. Amsoil and SMB will not be able to help you on this because they have their guidlines and must stick to them. Amsoils main concern is that some of the tape could work it's way into the engine. If it is put on properly this will not happen. Just a little common sense. I have many years experience under a lot of different situations. I base everything on personal experience. The restrictor was put in originally because Amsoil was worried that the full flow filter would not get enough oil to the bearings on startup. Now, they know that the natural restriction of the bypass filter at 1 micron is enough to make sure the full flow filter gets all of the oil it needs. It is also temp controlled and if you could somehow get your system to 180 degrees then the restrictor would be wide open which is what we are accomplishing by removing it, hence "The path of least resistance". Also, the Eao-26 filter does not work in the SMB. We don't really know why but I tried one in my Mustang for awhile 2 years ago and I lost power and fuel economy so I now have the Donaldson. I hope this answers all of your questions and concerns. If you would like to discuss any of these things you may call me at 714-390-7873. Amsoil Jim

[LanduytG]

Someone here really has no clue as to how this head really works! To me the best solution to this whole mess is take it off and use the OE full flow location and and a single bypass element and use the filter cap to get the oil supply to it like Amsoil already has.


Greg

[PatO]

Originally Posted by LanduytG

Someone here really has no clue as to how this head really works! To me the best solution to this whole mess is take it off and use the OE full flow location and and a single bypass element and use the filter cap to get the oil supply to it like Amsoil already has.


Greg

Unfortunately that is not a good solution for SMB 4x4 systems. Under extreme front suspension compression (passenger back wheel off the ground) the driveshaft U-Joint will hit and damage the OE cannister. The whole restrictor valve topic is trivial compared to the original intent of this thread. If you are still in a reverse flow configuration and your full and bypass filters do not get hot you have no filtering what so ever. Does anyone disagree with that statement?
Pat

[LanduytG]

Originally Posted by PatO

Unfortunately that is not a good solution for SMB 4x4 systems. Under extreme front suspension compression (passenger back wheel off the ground) the driveshaft U-Joint will hit and damage the OE cannister. The whole restrictor valve topic is trivial compared to the original intent of this thread. If you are still in a reverse flow configuration and your full and bypass filters do not get hot you have no filtering what so ever. Does anyone disagree with that statement?
Pat

I agree with you the restrictor is not that big a deal. But reverse flow is. As for the OE filter on all the 6.0L I've done the filter is on top of the motor. Now the 7.3 is on the bottom.

Greg

[PatO]

Originally Posted by LanduytG

I agree with you the restrictor is not that big a deal. But reverse flow is. As for the OE filter on all the 6.0L I've done the filter is on top of the motor. Now the 7.3 is on the bottom.

Greg

I don't know how to reply to that. Are you referring to pickups or vans? On my 2004 van the SMB/AMSOIL kit replaces an external line fed cannister and filter assembly with an adaptor block located low on the driverside of the engine block.
Pat

[LanduytG]

THe original equipment oil filter is mounted on top of the motor. What has been done is an adapter block made so you can get oil for the side of the motor of both Amsoil filters. A much easier way to have done this would have been lto use the Amsoil oil filter in the OE spot and add a single bypass filter and get the oil supply for that of the oil filter cap. IMHO what is being done is not the right way. First off the filters a a ways off and running through to much line. The shorter the line to better off you are. Again this in common scene engineering. The more hose you run the more restriction you have.


Greg

[Jammyauto]

My engine is bone stock. The oil filter is not on the top of the motor. It's on the left side mounted at the bottom of the block. It is VERY close to the front drivshaft. I would like to relocate mine but I'm not interested in the ASMoil setup. In fact after all this I'm really glad that I chose not to go this way. So far my drivshaft has not interfered with the oil filter but it is very close.

[LanduytG]

OK I just got off the phone with Brian in tech at Amsoil 715-392-7101. We all have the same access to the same people.

I asked way are they recommending the Donaldson filter over the Amsoil EaO26 and he said their not and did not know why that info was out there. Then I asked about the restrictor in the older bypass head and way are they recommending them being removed. Again he said they are not. In fact he agreed with me that if its removed the bypass filter will be near as effective.

We then discussed the new filter head because I have not had one in my hand. He said the restrictor as we no it in the old head is not in it however it is configured differently and still has one in it that cannot be seen.

So why is the EaO26 not being recommended? It is suppose to be to restrictive. How do we know that. Was a delta P taken to see the difference between the two filters? To just say its restrictive because performance is down and it didn't run right is not enough. That could have been caused by a multitude of things.

So now to address the issue a little further. The restrictor in the old head which I think most here have is there solely to provide a small back pressure so the bypass element which is first in line gets the proper flow. It has nothing to do with temperature nor the full flow getting more oil. If you want the full flow to get more oil then it needs removed but the bypass will not work a well.

I'm not trying to make anyone look bad here. I want people to have the right information so they can make and informed decision, because if you do something to alter the system and something craps out Ford has legal ground to deny warranty. SO now you look at Amsoil, well you removed the restrictor and getting oil from somewhere other than where we recommend it so you are SOL. SO now SMB is on the hook and what do think will happen there. Jim is on the hook for recommending all these things and do you think he will pay for the damage done. To have a dealer replace the motor would be at least $10K.

I have nothing to gain here. I have been selling Amsoil and Espar full time of over 10 years now. Have had almost 30 years of hands on with large equipment. I will not recommend something that will put your equipment in jeopardy because I don't want to pay for it. You may be thinking that I want to sell Amsoil, that's not true. I have told many that have Espar's in their SMB's that have asked me about Amsoil to call Jim because that it his business. I just want you to be aware of the ramifications if something goes wrong and you are left holding the bag.

So those waiting for something from Amsoil you will be waiting for a long time. This is the last post about this for me, you now know my side and way.

Greg