blown out Bilsteins - Page 4

Lance · 03-06-2021, 02:36 PM

Glad to hear I'm not the only one with this problem. Guess I'm lucky my mounts held up. I'm surprised that conversion shops aren't aware of these issues.

I've got a neighbor with 3 boys and more than 10 F Series trucks, lots of heavy jacks and want to help determine the droop. I'll report my findings.

That was my thought, maybe stops would resolve my issue.

Thanks so much for helping with pics.

Twoxentrix · 03-06-2021, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lance

Glad to hear I'm not the only one with this problem. Guess I'm lucky my mounts held up. I'm surprised that conversion shops aren't aware of these issues.

I have a SMW conversion, and back around 2016 I replaced all 4 shocks with Fox which I bought through SMW (on their recommendation). A year later I decided to add Dual front shocks, In the process we ended out replacing all of them again (this time with reservoir's) since the shop discovered the originals were all incorrect length. Both rears were shot and the shock mount bushings destroyed.
We ended out doing just as boywonder suggests to calculate the proper length. No issues since.

boywonder · 03-06-2021, 03:23 PM

I've reworked a few things on the front axle so my shock length issue was self-inflicted.

Lance....your other alternative would be to keep the same shock length (assuming you don't have a topping out issue) and lower your lower shock mount by about 1" if that's possible. Of course you'll have to convince yourself that you won't have a topping out issue with the mount lowered an inch. It can be a bit of an iterative process to get right, but the solution is simple.

When I'm suggesting lowering by 1" that also implies that you are going to install some bump stops....otherwise you'd have to lower more than that...

Lance · 03-06-2021, 05:12 PM

Just back from droop measuring. Extended length looks good, we left top mount of shock on and lower part of shock was 3/4" longer than mounting hole. Only one shock had failed, drivers side but other side looked like it got hot enough to melt some of the rubber boot. Bumper stops don't look like an easy install, at least not as easy as I would like.

When I get a new set of shocks is there much of a range of strength? I felt a lot of side to side bouncing when I'd hit an exposed rock. Or should I go with a rear sway bar to deal with that issue? Is that side to side bounce inherent to coil springs on a raised van?

Making progress!

boywonder · 03-06-2021, 06:14 PM

I may have a Bilstein chart..I'll look.

The next shorter size may be a better fit. What's the existing Shock P/N??

You can also source a thinner rubber donut for the top mount.....maybe gain 1/4"....I stole some off of my old ranchos..they were thinner.

With the shocks you have you'll need bump stops that when compressed by the axle are at least 1.5" tall....so maybe 2" or 2.5" when relaxed....depending on how stiff they are.

Is there no chance to move the lower mount lower by say 3/4"?

If you replace the shocks with the same length and no bump stops you'll destroy those too....

ctb · 03-06-2021, 06:34 PM

Even though I only had the V-8, Jon (Quadvan) put on an extra set of Bilsteins on front end...agreed even the V8 is heavy on the front end...Been over a LOT of washboard, both slow/creep and 35mph rampage...haven't had a problem/leak/etc yet...like the re-build idea, a LOT

Lance · 03-06-2021, 08:36 PM

I will definitely be installing stops, for sure. No way to lower mounting, that I can see. I'd like to keep it simple, find the right stops and probably go with same length of shock. My Bilsteins are 5125 series, # 33-230435. The hard part is drilling a hole to accept stop mount stud in such a tight space. There are a couple holes that might line up but appear small and maybe boxed in. I'll do some research and see what I can find. Crawl back under and study my options. Having both shocks off makes me glad I had one working. Thanks again to all..

Kibo · 03-07-2021, 12:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lance

A truck camper friend just told me about a bumper stop replacement called Sumo Springs. https://www.truckcamperadventure.com...amper-news_129

Ever heard of them?

Since no one else has chimed in on Sumo Springs, I'l give my $.02. I have Sumo Springs installed in the rear on my van, and I'm very happy with them. They're designed to make contact well before "bottoming out" and progressively dampen the impact as they compress (as much as 50%).

However, there are a couple of things you'd want to consider before installing them up front. 1) They're quite large, and 2) they're expensive. In my case they solved a particular issue--I was removing a lift block from my rear springs, and the stop was part of the lift block, so I needed something considerably longer than the original bumpstops. Looking at your pictures, I don't know whether you'd have enough space for a Sumo Spring.

I think mgmetalworks on here has had good experience with Sumo Springs on a coil spring front end, maybe reach out to him for advice?

Lance · 03-07-2021, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ctb

Even though I only had the V-8, Jon (Quadvan) put on an extra set of Bilsteins on front end...agreed even the V8 is heavy on the front end...Been over a LOT of washboard, both slow/creep and 35mph rampage...haven't had a problem/leak/etc yet...like the re-build idea, a LOT

Nice looking setup. Did Quad van install bump stops on your van? Not sure if they forgot to on mine or just don't use them. Do you know if your shocks are the same as mine just doubled up? I've got the V-10.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kibo

Since no one else has chimed in on Sumo Springs, I'l give my $.02. I have Sumo Springs installed in the rear on my van, and I'm very happy with them. They're designed to make contact well before "bottoming out" and progressively dampen the impact as they compress (as much as 50%).

However, there are a couple of things you'd want to consider before installing them up front. 1) They're quite large, and 2) they're expensive. In my case they solved a particular issue--I was removing a lift block from my rear springs, and the stop was part of the lift block, so I needed something considerably longer than the original bumpstops. Looking at your pictures, I don't know whether you'd have enough space for a Sumo Spring.

I think mgmetalworks on here has had good experience with Sumo Springs on a coil spring front end, maybe reach out to him for advice?

Glad to hear some feed back on Sumo's. I was wondering if a modified suspension would be a hard fit. I don't mind the $$$ if the results are there. Was there an issue you were trying to resolve? Did you notice an improvement in side to side bounce. Do you run a rear sway bar, too?

Kibo · 03-07-2021, 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lance

Glad to hear some feed back on Sumo's. I was wondering if a modified suspension would be a hard fit. I don't mind the $$$ if the results are there. Was there an issue you were trying to resolve?

My van is a Quigley, so the stock rear springs were used with a ~4" lift block to raise the van to match the front. I replaced the front springs on the van with taller springs to give more travel before hitting the bumpstops (a common complaint on Quigleys), and I decided to replace the stock rear springs and lift block with a new spring pack that didn't require a lift block. However, the lift block had an arm that would contact the bumpstop and limit travel:

With the lift block removed, the OEM bumpstop was now 4" further away from the axle and wouldn't limit travel. Others resolve this issue by building a spacer for the OEM bumpstop, but I decided to use Sumo Springs instead. The Sumo Spring sits closer to the axle than the OEM bumpstop did, but since it's designed to compress 50% it provides the same amount of travel but with a progressive nature instead of a hard stop:

Quote:

Did you notice an improvement in side to side bounce. Do you run a rear sway bar, too?

Honestly, I have not noticed any change in handling during normal driving. Even with stock shocks, I did not have side to side bounce. I do not have a rear sway bar either. The main noticeable difference is when hitting large holes or "g-outs" that cause the rear end to use up significant bump travel. Instead of a hard bottom out, I can definitely feel the Sumo Springs acting as a progressive spring over bumpy roads. (Caveat: the spring pack I installed is also more progressive in nature than the OEM spring pack.) I suspect the effect on handling would be more noticeable in the front, like having a stiffer front swaybar, but I have no firsthand experience.